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-   -   to cross train or not to cross train? (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21374)

dapidmini 06-03-2012 06:53 AM

to cross train or not to cross train?
 
I've been training in aikido since for about 5 years now and I fell in love with it since my first day of training. but I've been reading and feeling for myself that aikido requires very small amount of strength. since I'm still young (23 yo), I want to take advantage of it and spend some time learning other martial arts that requires physical fitness that can only be trained at young age, such as capoeira (so that I can have more knowledge and experience). of course I don't think that learning both at the same time would be a good idea because capoeira's style and objective is very different than aikido as I know it (I've a few classes of capoeira and read a bit of it).. so if I were to learn capoeira, I'll have to focus on it and take a leave from aikido. I'm not trying to mix all the martial arts and make my own style or something like that. I just want to learn as much as I can as long as I can...

what do you think I should do? or better yet, what would you do? should I stick to learning only aikido for my whole life or should I try learning other martial arts for awhile? :rolleyes:

dapidmini 06-03-2012 08:37 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
I meant "for about 5 years", not since.

ChrisHein 06-03-2012 11:22 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
I think the best thing you could do for yourself, your Aikido, and the Aikido community as a whole is to study a few other martial arts. Only one you step outside of Aikido, can you really appreciate certain aspects of it. A physical martial art is a good choice. I would also suggest finding something that has heavy sparring practice. Like Judo, Jiu Jitsu, Kickboxing or western boxing. It's interesting to start playing with people actively working against you in a constructive way.

Be open to what you are doing, you could decide you like whatever martial art you try better than Aikido. You could see Aikido anew and have an even deeper love for Aikido. Be open, it can only help!

I was around your age when I started doing competitive Jiujitsu, it was the best choice I ever made. It also made me appreciate Aikido more than I ever had before. If you ask me, GO FOR IT.

Kevin Leavitt 06-03-2012 02:17 PM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Ditto what Chris said.

lbb 06-03-2012 03:02 PM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
It depends on how much time you have to give to it. If you don't have enough time to train in your other style at least three times a week, and enough of a commitment to keep it up for at least several years, I think it's a waste of time to get started. If you decide to attend a weekend seminar here and there where you get a little exposure to some other style, that's no doubt fine and will broaden your mind, but without a true commitment of time and effort, you can't be said to be "training" in another style.

SeiserL 06-04-2012 04:41 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
I personally love cross-training.

My only advice is don't confuse or try to integrate the two (technique or principle) too soon. When you do aikido, do aikido. When you do something else, do something else. When you go home, be home.

PeterR 06-04-2012 04:49 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
I agree it can only help you appreciate what Aikido has to offer. The trick is to choose well - something that compliments without too much overlap.

I am partial to Judo/Aikido.

ryback 06-04-2012 06:49 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Aikido is a very difficult martial arts and it requires full commitment in order for one to learn it,so in my opinion cross training is wrong since every martial art has it's own principles.Set your priorities,then keep them straight and practice!

PeterR 06-04-2012 08:21 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Well see here is the issue.

Most of the legendary students had back ground in something other than Aikido and many of them did not stop with Aikido. Ueshiba himself was a cross-trainer.

A little bit of exploration allows you to find what really suits you.

Kevin Leavitt 06-04-2012 09:34 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Everyone I respect in Aikido with no exception has studied another art usually to at least shodan level even prior to Aikido. I don't think there is a coincidence there.

Kevin Leavitt 06-04-2012 10:01 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Probably a little too categorically, there are a few that haven't I suppose. Of course I have many friends that have only done Aikido that I have as well.

DH 06-04-2012 10:15 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
There is simply no way you are going to be a well rounded and capable Martial Artist training in single art. Though many think they are!
The key is finding arts -or certain other training- that compliment each other. And then, unless you are a rare genius... not more than two at a time. You can train in multiple arts and really confuse your body. Then, you can actually wind up worse rather than better.

You need to be able to have time to focus and burn in movement. You can't do that when your body is all over the place every week. You simply will not digest, inculcate and arrive at anywhere meaningful with many arts trained together. To be really bold, I will say to anyone, without ever having touched them "If you train in 4 or 5 arts at the same time....You suck!"
And I have never been proven wrong.
Dan

DH 06-05-2012 09:49 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Modern martial mayhem
"Hey Billy, see I'm doing Koryu, and Karate, and Aikido and Systema, and Daito ryu, and Bjj and internals...five nights a week,see!"
"No, Tommy, not really, no. You attend those classes...but that's all you really are...doing! I haven't seen you do any of them well!"


Dan

phitruong 06-05-2012 09:58 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Quote:

Dan Harden wrote: (Post 310312)
To be really bold, I will say to anyone, without ever having touched them "If you train in 4 or 5 arts at the same time....You suck!"
And I have never been proven wrong.
Dan

you meant all these grand masters who are masters of dozen different arts are kinda sucked? come on now! don't you think that underwater-basket-weaving would go well with aikido? what about okido or deja-fu or mamboryu? surely they would go well with aikido. :D

phitruong 06-05-2012 10:12 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Quote:

David Santana wrote: (Post 310226)
what do you think I should do? or better yet, what would you do? should I stick to learning only aikido for my whole life or should I try learning other martial arts for awhile? :rolleyes:

David, you are young and full of fire and vigor. go. go and do what you want and let your fire burns bright for awhile. i was kinda like that for awhile. when i first encountered aikido, i said it was not for me at the time, so i went off to learn to kick-ass and take names. years later i went back to aikido and have been here ever since. it's also help when my first aikido seminar was taught by Ikeda sensei. once i saw that i said "i want some of that, whatever that is". then i went to a seminar with Saotome sensei, and i said "i want some of that too!". i have been chasing "that" for awhile now. It's alot of fun so far. it's a great journey where you meet interesting folks and have your ass handed to you and keep wanting more.

a quote for you from one of my favorite movie "Ronin" - "Whenever there is any doubt, there is no doubt."

DH 06-05-2012 12:41 PM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Quote:

Phi Truong wrote: (Post 310414)
You meant all these grand masters who are masters of dozen different arts are kinda sucked? :D

Ahhh but see....
a. They never really were masters of all those arts.
b. Do you know how many Xdan Japanese teachers are not worth the price of admission?
I have watched any number of rather famous "Japanese" teachers who stunk up the place and their peers...who are good...all know it too. Just don't expect them to tell you that any day soon! :rolleyes:
All is not as it appears regardless of rank or affiliation! ;)
Dan

T-S 07-09-2012 01:04 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Sorry to hijack this thread, but I thought I'd post in here instead of starting a new one.

As I posted a while back, I've recently started learning Tomiki Aikido (only been there for about a month) and I'm really liking it. However, training is only twice a week at this Dojo, and I'd like to train in something a couple more times a week as well. Can any of you fine folk recommend a martial art that would compliment the Aikido I've just started learning but, ideally, is different enough not to confuse things?

I have no intention of stopping Aikido as I've wanted to learn it ever since I found about it but, like I said, it would be nice to train in something else as well, for fitness and practicality. I'm not saying that Aikido isn't practical, but my Sensei did imply it takes a long time to become proficient enough to be able to use it effectively.

Thanks :)

PeterR 07-09-2012 01:46 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Almost by definition Tomiki Aikido goes hand in hand with Judo.

Judo will allow you to start doing randori sooner (I am sure) and from experience it is much easier to get the hang of than Tomiki randori. When you do start Tomiki randori lesson learnt are applicable.

Tomiki was a Judoka and so were his best students. A lot of the terminology you will hear are common.

At one point in Japan I was in the same position - not enough training time in what I wanted to do and Judo worked out great.

Quote:

Thomas Shrapnel wrote: (Post 312631)
Sorry to hijack this thread, but I thought I'd post in here instead of starting a new one.

As I posted a while back, I've recently started learning Tomiki Aikido (only been there for about a month) and I'm really liking it. However, training is only twice a week at this Dojo, and I'd like to train in something a couple more times a week as well. Can any of you fine folk recommend a martial art that would compliment the Aikido I've just started learning but, ideally, is different enough not to confuse things?

I have no intention of stopping Aikido as I've wanted to learn it ever since I found about it but, like I said, it would be nice to train in something else as well, for fitness and practicality. I'm not saying that Aikido isn't practical, but my Sensei did imply it takes a long time to become proficient enough to be able to use it effectively.

Thanks :)


T-S 07-09-2012 02:12 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Hi Peter, thanks for the advice. I know of some Judo on offer very close to me so I'll check it out soon, assuming it's cool with my Aikido Sensei. I see no reason why it wouldn't be, but I'll run it by her anyway.

Thanks again.

Kevin Leavitt 07-09-2012 02:55 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Judo or BJJ. Judo is probably a better fit as the range is about the same as Aikido. However, BJJ is also a good one and closely related to Judo as well.

JJF 07-09-2012 04:42 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
well.. a lot can be gained from cross training. Depending on the style of aikido something will fill the 'gaps' better than others.

For atemi undestanding: karate or another striking art
For understanding center and how the japanese sword moves: iaido or (to a certain extend) kendo
For understanding the jo.. well.: jo do of course :)
For ukemi and balance: judo
For centering, balance and softness: tai chi

The list is endless and I have only mentioned a few of the martial arts that I know of. Many more could be added in each category, and to a certain extend they all teach the whole package - depending on how, where and with whom you train.

The trick is not to get the batter mixed up before each ingredient is ready. You can utilize something gained in one budo if you reflect upon it in a different context, but reflection requires time and effort. The risk is you get ahead of yourself. So.. by all means.. go train something that will help you blow some steam.. Soccer, baseball might do the trick - but if your heart is set on a different budo, talk to your sensei about it. Maybe he/she can give you good advice. And then do so, but keep your focus on what you perceive as you main budo.

Maybe you will feel the urge to change into something else - maybe you will fell that it lacks what you like about Aikido. but go explore. It will be good for you as long as you limit yourself to a few budos, and don't fill your head with more than you can process. It is a common mistake when you are young.. (and at my age as well one might add ;) )

Have fun - that's the most important.

T-S 07-09-2012 07:45 AM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Hi Jørgen, I just got home from class then. I asked if there were any more training opportunities during the weeks, and it looks like I'll be able to do some mid-week training (some weeks) with one of the Black Belts from the school. I also have a (much more experienced than I) friend who does a different style of Aikido, who said that he'd like to train with me sometimes as well. So, given those points, I think I'll stick with just Aikido for at least a few months, possibly/probably longer. If I really feel like it, I can always get a punching bag and practice a bit of the old MMA stuff I used to do.

Thanks for replying :)

bychang93 08-15-2012 07:45 PM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Sorry to hijack this thread too >.<

Just wanted to ask, is it a good or bad idea to cross-train Aikido with Karate?

Karate was one of the first budo I've been exposed to that really ignited my passion in martial arts, but I left the art because the Sensei was teaching us Competition nonsense like "if he punches your face, purposely receive the blow so that he will get a foul." I joined Yoshinkan Aikido afterwards, and have been loving it ever since.

Since I'm going to university soon, and they have Karate Society but no Aikido society, I'm thinking of taking up Karate again. Though, I've already forgotten most of the things I've learnt, except for the basic blocks >.<

What do you guys think? Do these 2 arts compliment each other?

David Yap 08-15-2012 11:58 PM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
Quote:

Bing Yen Chang wrote: (Post 314232)
What do you guys think? Do these 2 arts compliment each other?

Of course, they do. Just don't get a dumb ass for a karate teacher that you have mentioned in your post. I am curious, perhaps you can PM the name of the karate instructor who taught you such nonsense.

My regards to your teacher, Ramlan sensei.

Millsy 08-16-2012 01:31 PM

Re: to cross train or not to cross train?
 
My first sensei was against any other training, flat out banning you from training another art (or even with other aikido styles) as that would "mess-up" the aikido he was teaching. Many years later my current teachers encourage it. I feel, for me, Aikido is my primary art, and it has only been enhanced/informed by what I did before it and since I started. Others mileage may vary.


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