AikiWeb Aikido Forums

AikiWeb Aikido Forums (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/index.php)
-   Teaching (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=5)
-   -   Shouts for Sub-Teens (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15236)

Thomas Donelson 10-09-2008 03:29 AM

Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Part of Aikido is the confrontation of Anger or manipulation accompanying an attack.

Bullying is common among , 5 to 12, which I am calling Sub-Teens.

Another purpose of shouting when applying Aikido, is to make it clear to bystanders, that an attack is occurring, and the child applying Aikido, is being kind to an aggressor. If the teacher walks up and the bully is on the ground, with the victim standing, the bully may well say, "That Kid Pushed me down!!!" Then the teacher will likely punish the good' kindly practitioner of Aikido.

That is why I am more focused on the Dance part of Aikido, for deflecting a punch or a shove, with a wrist lock and not putting the attacker on the floor, or ground, but rather simply create space by Swinging the attacker away, by pulling on his wrist..


PHRASES FOR DISCHARGING ANGER:

Why are you trying to hurt me?

Why are you trying to hit me?

What makes you angry?

What are you angry about?

Why are you angry?

Stop trying to hit me.


CONFRONTING A BULLY:

Why are you trying to push me?

Why are you trying to hit me?

Stop trying to hit me.

Stop pushing me.

The object with a billy is to make his efforts to intimidate ineffective, and to ask the bully to behave.

..

Eva Antonia 10-09-2008 04:07 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Hello,

that's exactly what happened to my son (9,5) some two weeks ago.
He was attacked by some other boy in school, and instead of taking up a fight he just made some sideward movement and the attacker ran into the wall :crazy: . Big laughter from the side of my boy (he told me the story with great pride - "Mama, Tai sabaki WORKED!")

And afterwards the attacker complained to a teacher, saying that my son pushed him into the wall...but apparently the teacher did not believe him and didn't punish my son.

I think teachers generally know who is a bully and who is not.

Best regards,

Eva

Thomas Donelson 10-09-2008 04:58 PM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Eva Röben wrote: (Post 217881)
Hello,

that's exactly what happened to my son (9,5) some two weeks ago.
He was attacked by some other boy in school, and instead of taking up a fight he just made some sideward movement and the attacker ran into the wall :crazy: . Big laughter from the side of my boy (he told me the story with great pride - "Mama, Tai sabaki WORKED!")

And afterwards the attacker complained to a teacher, saying that my son pushed him into the wall...but apparently the teacher did not believe him and didn't punish my son.

I think teachers generally know who is a bully and who is not.

Best regards,

Eva

At the family dinner table, when I was a youngster, I used to occasionally kick my younger brother under the table, and then he usually would hit me with his fist, in my shoulder, so my parents would see my younger brother hit my shoulder. Often I would claim innocence, "I didn't do anything!" and my brother would be admonished to behave himself.

Glad your son was not punished by a false accusation.

Stepping aside, or stepping in and taking ahold of the attacker's arm, allows you to guide him.

A co-worker was horsing around at work today, so I practiced a wrist lock and moved my position in relation to his. When I walked away, it was not in retreat or in fear. Just changing positions.

The objective of the phrases I am teaching to sub-teens is to create a dialogue, and a tone of command. The dialogue could help the attacker to think through his actions, by being asked to talk.

The questions are rhetorical, partly a statement, so that witnesses catching a glimpse, can understand the reality. Giving the attacker a chance to explain his actions, gives the victim a chance to apologize, if an untended harm has appeared to have been caused by the victim. The victim asking questions gives the victim an appearance and feeling of being in control, and should diminish a sense of fear, and foster rational decision making. If several kids are ganging up, it may be time to run for it.

More Confronting a Bully:

Why are you trying to scare me?

Why are you trying to make me afraid you are going to hit me?

Why are you trying to hurt me?

..

gdandscompserv 10-09-2008 09:07 PM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Thomas Donelson wrote: (Post 217880)
PHRASES FOR DISCHARGING ANGER:

Why are you trying to hurt me?

Why are you trying to hit me?

What makes you angry?

What are you angry about?

Why are you angry?

Stop trying to hit me.

CONFRONTING A BULLY:

Why are you trying to push me?

Why are you trying to hit me?

Stop trying to hit me.

Stop pushing me.

The object with a billy is to make his efforts to intimidate ineffective, and to ask the bully to behave.

..

Thomas,
Have you found those questions to be effective when dealing with bullies?

jennifer paige smith 10-10-2008 10:52 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Thomas Donelson wrote: (Post 217911)
More Confronting a Bully:

Why are you trying to scare me?

Why are you trying to make me afraid you are going to hit me?

Why are you trying to hurt me?

..

Or...Hey, is your shoe untied?.....Whammo!:p

Mark Uttech 10-11-2008 03:23 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Onegaishimasu. Those questions could be asked by a bully to create a fake situation. There really is no be-all, or end-all, but to step aside. In aikido practice, we practice stepping aside, in the theory of: "how we practice is how we will be". Today's aikiweb doka by O Sensei refers to a 'perverted enemy', so the Founder had his scruples too.

In gassho,

Mark

Thomas Donelson 10-11-2008 03:32 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Ricky Wood wrote: (Post 217917)
Thomas,
Have you found those questions to be effective when dealing with bullies?

Effectiveness can be measured in several perspectives.

There is quite a lot of work and literature available recently on bullying. I will give more reference links on Bullying toward the end of this post.

There are several goals to be strived for in dealing with bullying, from the perspective of a bullying target or victim.

ESCALATION: One goal is to avoid escalating the situation, such that the bully feels overly threatened, and is forced to make further responses than if purely defensive actions are taken. The practice of Aikido can include Stephen Segal, breaking arms, legs and necks.

SELF-ESTEEM: Another goal is for the target to keep his self-esteem. The following is a quote form a Bullying resource, describing feelings that can result from being a target, that are not good for self-esteem.

"DON'T...

think it's your fault. Nobody deserves to be bullied!

fight back or bully a person back. This probably won't make things any better and it might get you into big trouble. Besides, you should try to act better than the person who bullies you.
keep it to yourself and just hope the bullying will "go away." It's normal to want to try to ignore bullying and hope that it will stop—or hope that the person will start to pick on someone else. But, often, bullying won't stop until adults and other kids get involved. So, be sure to report the bullying.

skip school or avoid clubs or sports because you're afraid of being bullied. Missing out on school or activities that you enjoy isn't the answer. You have a right to be there!

think that you're a "tattle tale" if you tell an adult that you've been bullied. Telling is NOT tattling! It's the right thing to do.
hurt yourself. Some kids who are bullied get so sad and depressed that they may try to hurt themselves because they think there is nothing else they can do. This definitely isn't the answer. Talk with an adult immediately and tell them how you are feeling. They can help stop the bullying."

http://www.stopbullyingnow.hrsa.gov/...sp?area=areyou

SECRECY: Another goal of a victim is to enlist help from others, and not keep excessive secrecy about being bullied. Shouting anything that indicates bullying is occurring is probably a discouragement to a bully. Bullies will often rely on secrecy, or not being seen or not discovered. Shouting about being bullied may be good for self-esteem, to indicate the target is not afraid of being found to be a target of bullying.

INJURY: Avoiding being injured is a goal of the target. However, the application of Aikido, without injuring the Bully, involves a risk of injury to the target. It would be less risky to disable and severely injure the Bully, because then the Bully would not be able to hurt the target, for sure. Injuring the bully, may cause an escalation of the conflict, where the bully feels he needs to further injure the target, to preserve his reputation.

A common practice in Aikido is place the attacker gently on the floor, so that the attacker most usually has to make the effort of standing up again, to resume his attack. In coming to a standing position, a re-thinking of realities and objectives sometimes occurs, so that the attacker is less dedicated to attacking the target.

I am suggesting that wrist locks and swinging the attacker, to change his position may be a sufficient repositioning to gain the benefits of the bully to re-think his dedication to intimidating the target.

I have not yet started a thread on Swing Techniques for dancing with an attacker, to diminish the attackers intent to injure, but I am contmplating startins a Swing thread..

Here are some Links about bullying, in general:

http://www.kidpower.org/SERVICES/Children.html

http://peacefulschoolsinternational.org/

http://www.loveourchildrenusa.org/

http://www.psychologymatters.org/bullying.html

http://www.stopbullyingnow.hrsa.gov/index.asp?area=main

Search: School Bullying

..

Thomas Donelson 10-11-2008 04:28 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Ricky Wood wrote: (Post 217917)
Thomas,
Have you found those questions to be effective when dealing with bullies?

I responded to your question and put in references to School Bullying, and when I submitted my response, with Links to references, the Message came back that my response would be reviewed by a moderator.

Basically, there are several objectives to consider when dealing with a Bully.

Self-Confidence of the Target.

Secrecy strategies for the Bully

Display of fear by the Target

Associations with the target's friends.

Adult intervention.

Witness management.

Injury risk to the Target

Excessive Injury to the Bully

Excessive Antagonism of the Bully

Positive Dialogue with the Bully

So these are some criterea by which to judge the effectiveness of shouted questions.


I do not mean to suggest that shouting indicriminantly is always the best option when confronted by a Bully. But having positive phrases in mind, to allow the bully to back off, while still saving face, can be constructive. Discussing and practicing shouting phrases during the practice of sub-teen Aikido training may at least increase self-confidence and reduce fear of bullies.

Search School Bullying

..

Thomas Donelson 10-11-2008 04:33 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Mark Uttech wrote: (Post 217947)
Onegaishimasu. Those questions could be asked by a bully to create a fake situation. There really is no be-all, or end-all, but to step aside. In aikido practice, we practice stepping aside, in the theory of: "how we practice is how we will be". Today's aikiweb doka by O Sensei refers to a 'perverted enemy', so the Founder had his scruples too.

In gassho,

Mark

I think you can use wrist locks and swing or dance with the opponent, or bully, Just changing positions in the hallway is a step to changing perspectives.

Thomas Donelson 10-11-2008 04:47 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Jennifer Smith wrote: (Post 217935)
Or...Hey, is your shoe untied?.....Whammo!:p

Certainly imaginary distractions and misdirections can be useful in the practice of Aikido. Getting the flow going on one direction, to build resistance that can be used in the planning of the next direction to move the opponent.

Any implications you would care to share?

..

jennifer paige smith 10-11-2008 04:57 PM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Thomas Donelson wrote: (Post 217954)
Certainly imaginary distractions and misdirections can be useful in the practice of Aikido. Getting the flow going on one direction, to build resistance that can be used in the planning of the next direction to move the opponent.

Any implications you would care to share?

..

In ideal, we use the way of no harm. But in certain instances the way of less harm is sufficient, and the way of harm reduction is primary.
We can respond with our physicality, with our current physical and creative skills, to deal with those who are obstructing our harmony; Our wellness.

So, sometimes the distraction, the lead of the mind, with a diversion, like 'you're shoe's untied', gives us the moment to get out of dodge (RunFu) or to take 'Ol Hoss' to the floor as in a quick shove or strike or whatever the body does to save itself.
I once saved my personal ass from 4 guys by leading their eyes upward to the sky while I swept out the feet of 'the leader'. He was shocked, the others recoiled, I re-gathered my footing and felt myself grow, in energy, to the size of a large alligator. They felt it, and thy fled.
Now, I was certain I was gonna get a take-down from my sensei for using my street skills, skills I had sworn to put away for the time being, so I kept the whole thing to myself for awhile before I let the cat out of the bag. But I found that there was a lot of pride and support within the dojo for my choice to use my fighting skills at an appropriate level. I was training for my Nikyu at the time and I wasn't certain I would be allowed to stay if I resorted to my previous violent responses. But the whole thing was tempered with my training.
I stopped 4 guys from kicking my ass and I am positive I stopped them from ever picking on any other girl in a pink shirt getting a newspaper, then and in the future. That was my experience.

Sure, they were bullies who need love, but I was preserving myself and I was assisted in alignment by a very creative energy that I never before felt in a fight. I believe that came from my heartfelt desire to maintain wellness for myself and 'keep the peace', or ' wholeness' if you define peace the way I do.
I also recall distinctly telling them what they were doing, not asking. As in 'Hey a-hole, you pushed me."And I didn't back down.

Not at all that your suggestions aren't correct, they are very good. There are also many others that come up that work. Each sitiuation requires our attention. That, to me, is Takemusu Aiki in a physical form.

So, some kids might get suspended for fighting if they stand up for themselves because of school policy. But that is a short and small punishment compared to the respect that they will gain from those who know better,likely including the bully themselves.

It is, in the end, a matter of discernment.

Thomas Donelson 10-13-2008 11:47 AM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Jennifer Smith wrote: (Post 217980)
I re-gathered my footing and felt myself grow, in energy, to the size of a large alligator. They felt it, and thy fled.
As in 'Hey [ ] you pushed me." And I didn't back down.

Not at all that your suggestions aren't correct, they are very good. There are also many others that come up that work. Each sitiuation requires our attention. That, to me, is Takemusu Aiki in a physical form.

So, some kids might get suspended for fighting if they stand up for themselves because of school policy. But that is a short and small punishment compared to the respect that they will gain from those who know better,likely including the bully themselves.

It is, in the end, a matter of discernment.

There is a time to back down, but there is little practice needed for backing down. Practice on Aikdo techniqes may be helpful for a youngster to stand ground.

Shouts, or words for Dialoge can also be practiced, for self convidence, catharsis for an abuser or attacker, and management of wintesses. If you call attantion to the attacker or abuser's offensive behavior, then witnesses may better remember that the victim's actions were purely defensive.

The 8 steps for Suzette Elgin, "You Can't Say that to Me" book involes dealing with ending the habit and rewards that bullies and abusers receive. The rewards may be a combination of angry attention, argument, constrnation of the victim, even if silence is maintianed, agitation can be detected by the bully. a measured response avoid rewarding with emotial turmoil for the victim.

..

jennifer paige smith 10-13-2008 09:32 PM

Re: Shouts for Sub-Teens
 
Quote:

Thomas Donelson wrote: (Post 218050)
There is a time to back down, but there is little practice needed for backing down. Practice on Aikdo techniqes may be helpful for a youngster to stand ground.

Shouts, or words for Dialoge can also be practiced, for self convidence, catharsis for an abuser or attacker, and management of wintesses. If you call attantion to the attacker or abuser's offensive behavior, then witnesses may better remember that the victim's actions were purely defensive.

The 8 steps for Suzette Elgin, "You Can't Say that to Me" book involes dealing with ending the habit and rewards that bullies and abusers receive. The rewards may be a combination of angry attention, argument, constrnation of the victim, even if silence is maintianed, agitation can be detected by the bully. a measured response avoid rewarding with emotial turmoil for the victim.

..

For myself, I think it is suffice to say I teach 17 aikido classes a week in high schools, middle schools and private schools where I have established dojos on campus.

Obviously there's a lot of need out there and we can always use more support in the cause, so thanks and keep up the good work/study.

Here's a link to one of my programs.
http://www.santacruz.k12.ca.us/alt_e...dspirit07.html

And thanks for the book recommendation.

Jen


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:24 AM.

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.