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Ellis Amdur 10-01-2008 04:43 PM

A Sense of Priorities
 
All this discussion on aikiweb about waza and ki and love and shihonage, and who had it and vectors and Kodo this and Ueshiba that and Sagawa all the time, broadcasting on AM twenty-four hours a day. And my eyes spin around in my head. So I go out and train. Grinding out the reps. Standing like a tree.
And I ask myself, there's many a time I'd rather be in a dim bar somewhere, cigarette smoke wreathing the lights, me out on the dance floor with my silver haired woman with her hair a little mussed up, beer on her breath and a run up one fish net stocking, with Omar and the Howlers singing "Big Round World," with another George Dickel sitting on the table waiting for me to swing by.
Shut up and train? Not tonight.

Ron Tisdale 10-01-2008 05:24 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
:D

I know you're a guy because you actually LIKE
Quote:

beer on her breath
.

No woman would ever say that... :D

Best,
Ron (love that post...)

ChrisMoses 10-01-2008 05:25 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
The WIN is strong in this thread.

:D

Thomas Campbell 10-01-2008 06:14 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Ellis Amdur wrote: (Post 217378)
my eyes spin around in my head.

That would be the effects of angular momentum from reading too much Erick Mead. To quote the good counselor (with affection, sir, not disdain):

[i][A fine balance must be struck and always try to keep them teetering at the edge of the sensation they are feeling for. If you don't do that and keep the dynamic toward ever less "firm" (apart from atemi) then the dynamic naturally tends toward the other gradient -- the testerone-competitive monster tends to jump in and starts the "me-bad" dynamic. It is not as helpful to development of good musubi connection.

Quote:
Can you define "juji" and its application?


Several of O-Sensei's Doka mention it, one even calls the art "jūjido." Juuji or jūji ( 十字 ) is the cross-shape or sign of the cross (for those so inclined). It is a symbol, a physical principle, a template for technique and spiritual basis for contemplation of practice.

As kanji, 十 juu not only means "cross" and "ten" but also "whole" or "complete." As a symbolic image in Japan, the horizontal symbolizes Earth, and the vertical symbolizes Heaven, i.e. -- tenchi, the union of heaven and earth at the center. It is another means of depicting in-yo with the dynamic elements of the opposed eight powers (bagua) built in.

As a physical principle, juji depicts the action of perpendicular component forces. In motion in a linear plane, perpendicular forces resolve to linear diagonal forces in proportion to magnitude of the two components. Judo in contrast focuses on using or creating an offsetting pair of opposed forces (a couple) to initiate rotation. In an already rotational or vibrational frame, force perpendicular to the rotational or vibrational plane have resulting perpendicular forces that are not linear, because of the inherent angular momentum, the resultant force depends on where along the radius of rotation/vibration the output is taken. The fact of that momentum also allows the sytem to absorb a great deal of energy withou out readily perceptible change.

Juji in aikido presupposes that there is an existing rotational or vibrational energy to receive and gyroscopically transform a single input force into perpendicular output at a variable scale of radial amplification. That vibration or energy is ki no kokyu, or if you prefer the technical description, the physical application of the principle of virtual work on an instantaneously and infintesimally rotating body (at each joint rotational articualtion in turn and ultlimately at the collective rotational center of mass (tanden).

As a template for technique, heaven and earth are joined statically by their intersection at the center, and thus the center is arrived at by moving directly along the line. The conduit for kokyu tanden is established by feeling of that angle "lock" where the components of force are all cancelled in one dimension, leaving a complete freedom of movement there. The vertical dimension and the horizontal dimension of the figure are also joined dynamically by the fact that one becomes the other by simple rotation. Thus, the center is arrived at by spiral motion. /I]

Ellis Amdur 10-01-2008 06:29 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Ron - I see you haven't yet been initiated in the gokui.

Of course a woman wouldn't like beer on my breath. What she likes is that I don't mind beer on hers.

"No, darlin' don't change stockings. That run gives it character."

Ellis

Buck 10-01-2008 06:55 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
What if you can't dance?

Ron Tisdale 10-01-2008 07:04 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Dude, everyone knows white guys can't dance...
:D

Ellis, I just had to read the whole thread to my fiance who had no clue why I fell out of my chair...
B,
R

E

DH 10-01-2008 07:08 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Ron Tisdale wrote: (Post 217392)
Dude, everyone know white guys can't dance...
:D

Ellis, I just had to read the whole thread to my fiance who had no clue why I fell out of my chair...
B,
R

E

DUDE...I've seen your tight ass try to move. :eek:
I'll shake it next to you any day of the week and buy the beer and let our girls decide who's got the moves:D
White guys can't dance?...hah!:D

Ron Tisdale 10-01-2008 07:11 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Damn! Fell out of my chair 3 times tonight!

Ok, uptight suburban black guys can't dance either!

B,
R :D (my vote we move this to the humor section...)

DH 10-01-2008 07:13 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Ellis Amdur wrote: (Post 217378)
All this discussion on aikiweb about waza and ki and love and shihonage, and who had it and vectors and Kodo this and Ueshiba that and Sagawa all the time, broadcasting on AM twenty-four hours a day. And my eyes spin around in my head. So I go out and train. Grinding out the reps. Standing like a tree.
And I ask myself, there's many a time I'd rather be in a dim bar somewhere, cigarette smoke wreathing the lights, me out on the dance floor with my silver haired woman with her hair a little mussed up, beer on her breath and a run up one fish net stocking, with Omar and the Howlers singing "Big Round World," with another George Dickel sitting on the table waiting for me to swing by.
Shut up and train? Not tonight.

God I wish I could talk my strawberry blond babe into moving to Seattle. My life would be so much sweeter in so many ways.

Ki?? Love waza? eyes spinning?
I can post fast while working, train with my son, train twenty hours a week and still manage to have fun with my wife and install new countertops...I have glue on my fingers right now!

Actually I Love aikiweb. When it comes to Budo I think it is thee premier site on the web. I hope the interplay and difficult topics-which we sometimes engage in doesn't take away from some of the very learned and informative contributions, and also the good humor that so many seem to posess.

Beer on her breath...run in her stockings...hey ..I gotta go...;)

Thomas Campbell 10-01-2008 07:54 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Dan Harden wrote: (Post 217397)
God I wish I could talk my strawberry blond babe into moving to Seattle.

Please keep trying.

Erick Mead 10-01-2008 08:24 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Thomas Campbell wrote: (Post 217384)
That would be the effects of angular momentum from reading too much Erick Mead. To quote the good counselor (with affection, sir, not disdain):
... Thus, the center is arrived at by spiral motion. /I]

Thus, I try not to mix thinking and drinking -- never with great success, mind you...:) And spirals are easier to achieve drinking than thinking, in any event.

MM 10-02-2008 08:31 AM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Dan Harden wrote: (Post 217397)
God I wish I could talk my strawberry blond babe into moving to Seattle. My life would be so much sweeter in so many ways.

Ki?? Love waza? eyes spinning?
I can post fast while working, train with my son, train twenty hours a week and still manage to have fun with my wife and install new countertops...I have glue on my fingers right now!

Actually I Love aikiweb. When it comes to Budo I think it is thee premier site on the web. I hope the interplay and difficult topics-which we sometimes engage in doesn't take away from some of the very learned and informative contributions, and also the good humor that so many seem to posess.

Beer on her breath...run in her stockings...hey ..I gotta go...;)

Ellis' thread has you glued? And to top it off, you couldn't counter it? :D I'd probably tack on that you must be possessed. Ah well, I'll just nail shut this post. Otherwise, I might hammer the jokes in too hard. Could be worse, I could be screwy. :D

SeiserL 10-02-2008 11:55 AM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Ron Tisdale wrote: (Post 217392)
Dude, everyone knows white guys can't dance...

Except those from Detroit.

SeiserL 10-02-2008 11:57 AM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Ellis Amdur wrote: (Post 217378)
Shut up and train? Not tonight.

Priorities?

I know I don't have "it", but I know I have "her", and that sounds like the right priority to me. Family first.

Buck 10-02-2008 02:26 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
As I interpret Ellis, since a big part of Aikido is interpretation, why then train?

I think, at least me, started off full steam ahead when we first started, with great big hungry eyes for Aikido and all the mystery and magic was romance happening under a starry sky, it was addicting once embrace that dance.

Years wear and time put in is logged like a that of a veteran commercial Jet Pilot. The eyes less hungry, the crows feet stamped a little deep the mystery and magic is replaced with experience and knowledge. The romance fades and a relationship takes place.

Then the marks of time wears upon our face, the hair is less and the bell more mirrors the relationship where routine grinds down each clog of practice, stripping what is left of the mystery and magic, momentum. The eyes have seen enough, they are more then full. It is a habitual ritual routine.

Then the one last dance begains with the sway of two souls hand in hand, greyed with age, to the soft music and dim lights of the dance floor, Aikido begains again.

Ellis Amdur 10-02-2008 03:02 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Honey, let's get up and get another drink. And let's get one of those garlic things. Makes my blood heat up. Naw, baby, I don't care what your breath smells like. I'm gonna be smelling just the same and we won't notice anyway, later - particularly if we get that other drink. And how about we move to another table. There's some guy behind us talking about aikido.

Ellis Amdur 10-02-2008 03:29 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
What? Yeah, buddy, we were talking about you. And you are offended? You gave offense when you opened your mouth. Wait a second here. What? No, no, no. Don't talk to my wife. DON'T TALK ABOUT ME TO MY WIFE! You talk to me.

Don't give me any of that aikido is reconciliation of conflict stuff You want some reconciliation of conflict. Shut up will do, just fine.

Whoa, don't get your hakama in a twist, man. This is the wrong kind of bar for that, man, we don't go for that kind of talk, "sway of two souls, hand in hand." OK, have it your way. "Embrace" this dance. <THUD >

<Sigh> I know, honey. I'm sorry. But I mean, we picked this place out specially because we heard that aikido people were barred at the door, and Daito-ryu folks were '86'd as soon as they started cramping or whatever the heck they do.

Yeah, I do have a temper. Sorry. What? - yah thought it was kinda hot when I dropped him? Gee, I guess this stuff comes in handy every once in awhile. - - - hey, yah wanna go home now? O.K., that's cool. A couple more dances first. Don't trip over the guy - the bouncers will be dragging him out in a minute.

Thomas Campbell 10-02-2008 06:19 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Ellis Amdur wrote: (Post 217476)
Honey, let's get up and get another drink. And let's get one of those garlic things. Makes my blood heat up. Naw, baby, I don't care what your breath smells like. I'm gonna be smelling just the same and we won't notice anyway, later - particularly if we get that other drink.

"I sure do appreciate you're sittin' here . . . "

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wFpvRMIIEM

gdandscompserv 10-02-2008 06:32 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
I'll be seeing Neil Young at the end of the month. He's at the Forum in LA. Did you know that place is owned by a church? Yup, Neil Young Thursday night and God on Sunday morning. Kinda makes me want to hang 'round till Sunday for services.
EVERY SUNDAY at 10:00 am - Faithful Central Bible Church w/ Bishop Kenneth C. Ulmer
If you like it a little heavier, AC/DC and Metallica in December.
Southern California's an interesting place sometimes.
You sure ya don't wanna visit Dan?
:D

Mark Mueller 10-02-2008 11:06 PM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Ellis,

You been reading Charlie Huston?

Ellis Amdur 10-03-2008 12:06 AM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Nah, I don't need any inspiration. That's just the way I see the world. Who's Charlie Huston?
I mean seriously, Omar and the Howlers or shihonage? C'mon.

mjchip 10-03-2008 04:41 AM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Thomas Campbell wrote: (Post 217401)
Please keep trying.

No, please dont.

Mark

Peter Goldsbury 10-03-2008 05:42 AM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Quote:

Ellis Amdur wrote: (Post 217378)
All this discussion on aikiweb about waza and ki and love and shihonage, and who had it and vectors and Kodo this and Ueshiba that and Sagawa all the time, broadcasting on AM twenty-four hours a day. And my eyes spin around in my head. So I go out and train. Grinding out the reps. Standing like a tree.
And I ask myself, there's many a time I'd rather be in a dim bar somewhere, cigarette smoke wreathing the lights, me out on the dance floor with my silver haired woman with her hair a little mussed up, beer on her breath and a run up one fish net stocking, with Omar and the Howlers singing "Big Round World," with another George Dickel sitting on the table waiting for me to swing by.
Shut up and train? Not tonight.

Hello Ellis,

Amazing thread. Haven't a clue what it means, apart from dancing, laddered stockings, beer on the breath, and hair not arranged quite right (I presume this is what mussed means, or is it a certain kind of shampoo).

Clearly more research will be needed into the cultural context of aikido, especially on some crucial questions:

Who was George Stickel? Was he one of those 'hidden' students of Sokaku Takeda, like the Korean we have heard abourt?
Why was he 'sitting on the table' and waiting for you' to 'swing by'? Did you have to do a special kind of walk, perhaps as a signal to receive some vital information on Ueshiba's relationship to Takeda, essential for your book? Perhaps some essential information about vectors that Erick has not yet discovered?
Who are Omar and the Howlers? Are they some middle eastern religious group? Perhaps an off-shoot of Omoto in the Middle East (after all, Omoto was an international religion and the names of both groups begin with O, which might mean Omega, and is probably a hidden reference to kotodama).
In addition, they were Howlers, which is probably because they were howling (= a special form of what Omoto calls chinkon-kishin).
Are Omer and the Howlers noted for internal training, or do they just prefer to do waza?

Of course, a major question raised by this thread--and probably one not even considered by Ueshiba, would be: the essential connection between dancing, waza and IT.

:D

PAG

Peter Goldsbury 10-03-2008 06:32 AM

Re: A Sense of Priorities
 
Ahhh, The editing time ran out.

It was George Dickel and not George Stickel. Clearly a pseudonym, designed to sound like the original, or vice versa (or verce visa: who knows?).

And there were at least two of them. Ellis had obviously already met one--and had clearly failed in the first transaction, but there was another.

This is very deep...

:straightf


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