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-   -   Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc; (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12599)

BlaccBillyJacc 05-16-2007 03:10 PM

Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Greetings all, I came across this link of some of the late Dr. Moses Powell's students performing Sanuces Ryu Jui Jitsu, I remember seeing a demo live in NYC about 4 years ago and it reminded me of Akido in many ways.......What do yo think?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlmyF...elated&search=

Don_Modesto 05-17-2007 02:46 PM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Quote:

Darrell Horne wrote: (Post 178518)
Greetings all, I came across this link of some of the late Dr. Moses Powell's students performing Sanuces Ryu Jui Jitsu, I remember seeing a demo live in NYC about 4 years ago and it reminded me of Akido in many ways.......What do yo think?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlmyF...elated&search=

I've trained with a group here in Ft. Lauderdale (Gus Hernandez, student of Phil Chenique in Miami), learned a lot, and think very highly of them.

BlaccBillyJacc 05-17-2007 09:50 PM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Hi Don, Thanks for your reply. I've never trained with their students I only stopped in to visit a friend at that time and found it interesting.

In your dealings with them did you notice any similarities to your system of Aikido?

Thanks again.:)

Don_Modesto 05-18-2007 11:25 AM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Quote:

Darrell Horne wrote: (Post 178649)
In your dealings with them did you notice any similarities to your system of Aikido?

It's jujutsu, like aikido, so you will have a great deal of overlap--SHIHONAGE, KOTE GAESHI, IKKYO, etc. But Atemi-ryu folks work in a lot more nastiness. Whereas in aikido we normally take someone to the mat and pin, they will do techniques to break them in four places before taking them down and then pantomime breaking their neck, e.g. No doubt many aikido players would find this objectionable.

If it needs saying, Atemi-ryu folk are focused on street application where technique is concerned. Gus himself seems personally interested in philosophy and spirituality, but makes no bones about the fact that he wanted to be able to hurt someone in a violent engagement. Something I found very insightful about his teaching is how he would distinguish situations and appropriate applications, e.g., "Do this if it's five guys in a deserted parking lot, do this if it's your cousin Frank drunk at sis's wedding."

This group has taken some pretty enthusiastic body slams on various internet fora due to claims on Atemi-ryu websites other MAs find questionable. I don't even get into that debate. But what I found consistently while on the mat at Gus's or at seminars in Miami with Chenique or Moses Powell, was hard work, sincerity and respect. I quite enjoy training with them.

George S. Ledyard 05-18-2007 11:57 AM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Moses Powell was one of the legendary martial artists in the early days of martial arts in New York City. Back in the seventies you were expected to be able to fight. Crime was out of control and people went into a dojo to learn to defend themselves. If you wanted your school to stay open you had to be able to handle yourself. Guys from other schools would come in and challenge you and if you couldn't handle yourself, no one wanted to train with you.

Moses Powell should have been famous in aiki circles. It is rather tragic, in my opinion, that he is barely known. He went off in a direction that isolated him from the larger community, became a body guard and trainer for security for Lewis Farakhan and the Nation of Islam. Later he fell in with some questionable companions and was off in Central America doing security training for some folks who needed serious security. All of this took him out of the main stream and he more less dropped out of site.

But the man's ability was unquestionable. If your interest is in street application of Aikido, then you should check these folks out. This is not the aiki dance crowd. Unfortunately Powell Sensei died a few years back. But there are some folks out there who trained with him for several decades and the are very good. There are some videos available of Powell Sensei, although I think they are only in VHS.

jennifer paige smith 05-20-2007 10:58 AM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Quote:

Don J. Modesto wrote: (Post 178687)
It's jujutsu, like aikido, so you will have a great deal of overlap--SHIHONAGE, KOTE GAESHI, IKKYO, etc. But Atemi-ryu folks work in a lot more nastiness. Whereas in aikido we normally take someone to the mat and pin, they will do techniques to break them in four places before taking them down and then pantomime breaking their neck, e.g. No doubt many aikido players would find this objectionable.

If it needs saying, Atemi-ryu folk are focused on street application where technique is concerned. Gus himself seems personally interested in philosophy and spirituality, but makes no bones about the fact that he wanted to be able to hurt someone in a violent engagement. Something I found very insightful about his teaching is how he would distinguish situations and appropriate applications, e.g., "Do this if it's five guys in a deserted parking lot, do this if it's your cousin Frank drunk at sis's wedding."

This group has taken some pretty enthusiastic body slams on various internet fora due to claims on Atemi-ryu websites other MAs find questionable. I don't even get into that debate. But what I found consistently while on the mat at Gus's or at seminars in Miami with Chenique or Moses Powell, was hard work, sincerity and respect. I quite enjoy training with them.

I'm pleased to find the ending line of this post is "I quite enjoy training with them". As I was reading along I was cloaked in the thought that everyone needs to find a starting place that matches them right where they are. If you are a hands on kinda gal (or man) you may want some blue collar aiki, and that is perfect for you. It may not be good for someone else who simply can't relate to the beginning point. Within the teachings of the art the nuance and lessons emerge to the practicioner, whatever level you're at.This is the profound beauty of human and character variety.

One of the greatest American (Lakota) warriors was Chief Sitting Bull. He is quoted to have said "It is not necessary for eagles to be crows." Besides the implicit animistic Lakota references in this statement, it implies that we are all our own natures and we do not need to be something we are not. We don't have to put on crow feathers to practice or eagle feathers to practice. We simply learn to fly as the birds that we are.

I believe I would have loved to have practiced with Moses Powell, but I am too young to have done so. I believe that I am a wider human being ( although I'm cutting down on carbs:p ) from the variety of training that I have undergone, and my training provides me with the tools to continue in my explorations of less comfortable environments. I was more comfortable in the blue collars than the whites. Now, I wear a gi without a collar. I can go anywhere I am invited.

By the way, my Mother lives in Ft. Lauderdale, hint-hint.( all smiles, just being silly.)

jennifer paige smith 05-20-2007 11:04 AM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Quote:

Don J. Modesto wrote: (Post 178618)
I've trained with a group here in Ft. Lauderdale (Gus Hernandez, student of Phil Chenique in Miami), learned a lot, and think very highly of them.

Do you know the Nage in this demonstration video?

Don_Modesto 05-20-2007 03:32 PM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Quote:

Jennifer Smith wrote: (Post 178788)
Do you know the Nage in this demonstration video?

Sorry, no.

Tijani1150 05-22-2007 11:16 PM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
awsome video, awsome techniques so beautifuly applied

George S. Ledyard 05-23-2007 12:17 AM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Quote:

Jennifer Smith wrote: (Post 178788)
Do you know the Nage in this demonstration video?

I believe that the nage is Prof. Darryl King, 8th Dan who was a direct student of Moses Powell Sensei

Michael Varin 05-23-2007 01:52 AM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
A better question is: Who is the uke?

He's excellent.

Nice video.

BlaccBillyJacc 05-23-2007 01:02 PM

Re: Jiu Jitsu, Hapkido, Akido,Etc;
 
Greetings all, I am very pleased and humbly grateful for all of your responses.

I didn't know that Prof. Powell did security for the N.O.I. or in South America. I do remember meeting him at a YMCA in West Philadelphia back in the 80's when I was taking Shotokan Karate.

He was friends with one of the instructors there who also had a black belt under him.

He was very nice, humble, & imformative but you could also sense his noblity & notice his command for respect.....not like a thug or anything it was just in his walk, his presense...know what I mean?

There are more videos of them on YOUTUBE if any one needs to see more.http://youtube.com/watch?v=LbcRm377aeQ

I like Akido & would like to train in it one day, I've been in HKD on/off since 98' & have slowed down a lot in the last two years due to two major injuries,(i.e. broken toe from kicking,:o level 3 groin injury from grappling):yuck:

I've recently started training in Muay Thai over at Dan Inosanto's JKD Academey a couple of days a week. :p I truly believe that in about two years when I'm about 42 I'll be heading towards Akido and that'll be my swan song.;)


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