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-   -   Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only one finger? (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11855)

AikiWeb System 02-18-2007 12:30 AM

Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only one finger?
 
AikiWeb Poll for the week of February 18, 2007:

How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only one finger?
  • I don't do aikido
  • Completely realistic
  • Somewhat realistic
  • Not very realistic
  • Not at all realistic
Here are the current results.

Chuck Clark 02-18-2007 06:00 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only one finger?
 
Not at all realistic. It takes the whole mind/body system .... the connection can be achieved and maintained through one finger though.

billybob 02-18-2007 10:14 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only one finger?
 
Chuck Clark said:
Quote:

Not at all realistic. It takes the whole mind/body system .... the connection can be achieved and maintained through one finger though.

I agree with Mr. Clark about connection via one finger, but voted 'completely realistic'. I read the question to mean 'using only one's finger' rather than assuming it implied a finger wriggling detached on the mat. :)

As an example - perform a good irimi from shomen uchi and step fully behind uke - hook the collar of their gi at the neck and bend your knees. If you have their balance it works nicely (as I'm sure everyone knows)

dave

rcoit 02-19-2007 10:08 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only one finger?
 
For one who practices regularly, focus can be directed to any body part ( especially if it is a pivot-point). A finger or other focal point, carefully placed ( eye, throat, gi (as above), ), can direct uki anywhere.

MikeLogan 02-19-2007 11:20 PM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
No one else here trains in boogerminage? Sorry, it's after 1AM, and I haven't posted in oh so long. Couldn't resist.

michael.

Dirk Hanss 02-20-2007 04:17 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
A poining or punching finger is very effective, if you know where to put it.

We had some exercises doing an ikkyo with only the two pointerfingers to lead uke.

I tried and it was just rubbish. I felt an it work astonishingly well, I saw (Mitsugi Saotome) and just the two fingers made the strong French 6th dan look like a fool.

my 2 cts


Dirk

philipsmith 02-20-2007 08:53 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
Depends whose using the finger.
I remember an excruciating Nikkyo being applied to me with a finger of each hand by the late Doshu.

20 years later I still can't do it.

David Humm 02-20-2007 09:21 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
Quote:

AikiWeb System wrote: (Post 169003)
AikiWeb Poll for the week of February 18, 2007:

How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only one finger?
  • I don't do aikido
  • Completely realistic
  • Somewhat realistic
  • Not very realistic
  • Not at all realistic
Here are the current results.

The qualifier is: co-operation or non-cooperation on the part of uke?

Co-operative practice isn't "realistic" or "effective" to use the words in the polled question.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out that an uncooperative individual isn't going to freely allow any technique let alone one applied with just one finger (even with one on each hand).

Chuck Clark 02-20-2007 09:50 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
Quote:

Dave Humm wrote: (Post 169207)
The qualifier is: co-operation or non-cooperation on the part of uke?

Respectfully, (refer to post #2) When done properly a connection through one finger (even with the only cooperation being a good attack from the uke who is intent on really causing a problem for the tori) is possible. If anyone has been practicing for some time and hasn't experienced this from a skillful person, they should investigate what is possible from people that they haven't been around before.

I have felt this from a number of people in the past and I guarantee you that I attack with intent to not be "cooperative". When I'm uke with anyone they have to earn the waza and I appreciate the return favor.

Best regards,

Suru 02-20-2007 06:54 PM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
The only time I've experienced one-finger submission was as osae-waza, with an index finger in that nasty little spot below the Adam's apple. Nage had to get me onto the floor in the first place with more than one finger though.

Clark Sensei, you may not wish to discuss it due to your USMC code of honor, but were there any major similarities between Marine combat training and Aikiwaza?

Mike, I'm still laughing about the booger joke...thank you for that.

Drew

xuzen 02-20-2007 10:27 PM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
You have got to be kidding... Not at all realistic :grr:

Boon.

garry cantrell 02-21-2007 09:16 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
I interpreted the question to refer to intances wherein uke grabs the index finger of nage - and nage responds with ikkyo. I've done it that way lots, but never thought anyone was advocating that approach as anything other than a training exercise (it's pretty obvious pretty quickly when you're leading with just your finger and you're doing it wrong). So, my first thought was, no, it's not realistic at all. BUT, should someone grab your index finger (I'm immediately reminded of 3rd grade fart jokes "here! pull my finger!") I guess you don't have any choice now do you? Whaddarya going to do? Give up because your attacker has used a stupid attack? "I'm sorry, please release my finger and utilize a serious attack." So, I changed my answer to positive.

Chuck Clark 02-21-2007 10:26 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
Quote:

Drew Gardner wrote: (Post 169270)
Clark Sensei, you may not wish to discuss it due to your USMC code of honor, but were there any major similarities between Marine combat training and Aikiwaza?
Drew

Mr. Gardner, I haven't addressed you personally in a number of years. I have absolutely no idea how you might have any real, personal experience with my "USMC code of honor" that gives you a reason to bring something like that up in association with the question you asked. Some of my USMC "sensibilities", however, become hyper-sensitive when I read many of your posts. By the way, from my experience over the years reading your posts, I agree with and congratulate you that you made a very good decision when you didn't show up for an appointment to the Air Force Academy.

In answer to your question, yes, there are a number of similarities between USMC combat training and Aikiwaza.

Sincerely,

Suru 02-22-2007 06:19 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
Quote:

Chuck Clark wrote: (Post 169363)
Mr. Gardner, I haven't addressed you personally in a number of years. I have absolutely no idea how you might have any real, personal experience with my "USMC code of honor" that gives you a reason to bring something like that up in association with the question you asked. Some of my USMC "sensibilities", however, become hyper-sensitive when I read many of your posts. By the way, from my experience over the years reading your posts, I agree with and congratulate you that you made a very good decision when you didn't show up for an appointment to the Air Force Academy.

In answer to your question, yes, there are a number of similarities between USMC combat training and Aikiwaza.

Sincerely,

I have never seen you in person and only know you from many old posts. I read on a seminar flier recently that you're a Marine. I was borderline obesessed with the military in general growing up, partially due to the fact that my dad was a first lieutenant in the U.S. Army and a Viet Nam vet. As for the specific Marine honor code, I know little about it other than it exists and that it serves a vital purpose to the betterment of this world. Thank you for your response.

Drew

James Davis 02-22-2007 11:52 AM

Re: Poll: How realistic is doing a physically effective aikido technique with only on
 
It can be done, but don't ask me to demonstrate it.:D


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