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-   -   Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo? (http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10562)

AikiWeb System 06-25-2006 12:30 AM

Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
AikiWeb Poll for the week of June 25, 2006:

Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
  • I don't do aikido
  • Yes
  • No
Here are the current results.

Don_Modesto 06-25-2006 12:44 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Jun, aren't you the one who asked, "How long is a string?"

akiy 06-25-2006 12:55 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Don J. Modesto wrote:
Jun, aren't you the one who asked, "How long is a string?"

I plead the fifth.

-- Jun

Kent Enfield 06-25-2006 01:00 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
I'm curious what principle the people who voted "Yes" find is not in other budo.

Mark Uttech 06-25-2006 01:23 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Aikido teaches turning, and turning, and turning. This turning becomes a return. Where does this turning take place? In you. You must stop fighting and learn to turn the fight into something else.. You cannot exhaust aikido.You cannot run out of it. Cover your openings and learn to face your death. I do not think the other arts teach this principle.

Don_Modesto 06-25-2006 01:36 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Mark Uttech wrote:
Aikido teaches turning, and turning, and turning. This turning becomes a return. Where does this turning take place? In you. You must stop fighting and learn to turn the fight into something else.. You cannot exhaust aikido.You cannot run out of it. Cover your openings and learn to face your death. I do not think the other arts teach this principle.

Which have you studied?

Charles Cunningham 06-25-2006 08:29 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
I don't understand how anyone could be in a position to authoritatively answer "yes" to this question, since an affirmative answer presupposes a thorough understanding the principles behind each and every budo.

Charles

Jonathan Han 06-25-2006 08:47 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Mark Uttech wrote:
Aikido teaches turning, and turning, and turning. This turning becomes a return. Where does this turning take place? In you. You must stop fighting and learn to turn the fight into something else.. You cannot exhaust aikido.You cannot run out of it. Cover your openings and learn to face your death. I do not think the other arts teach this principle.

I respectfully disagree. I've been studying bagua (a Chinese internal martial art). It is all about turning and circles, both external and internal. I think Aikido could incorporate a few turning tricks that works better and saves our knees from potential damage. I don't think Aikido contains physical principles not present in other martial arts. Nor does it lack anything present in other martial arts (at least the arts I've been exposed to). But since the question said "budo" are we limiting the comparison to just a few Japanese styles?

Don_Modesto 06-25-2006 09:54 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Charles Cunningham wrote:
I don't understand how anyone could be in a position to authoritatively answer "yes" to this question, since an affirmative answer presupposes a thorough understanding the principles behind each and every budo.

Charles

My thoughts, too.

mathewjgano 06-25-2006 10:12 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Jonathan Han wrote:
But since the question said "budo" are we limiting the comparison to just a few Japanese styles?

I don't think so...just as I think a topic about "neko" could include anything cat-like.

mathewjgano 06-25-2006 10:29 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
I put "no" because while I do think Aikido is unique when taken on the whole, I don't think the specifics are entirely unique, particularly the physical aspects.
Off the top of my head: connecting, rotating, entering, blending, balance/unbalancing, whole-body integration, leading, timing, efficiency...all of these things (and I'm sure any I may not have considered) are found elsewhere to some degree or another.

Mark Uttech 06-26-2006 10:50 AM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
another puzzling poll... I answered 'yes' because the majority of the popular martial arts put you in a cage, and I didn't want to go in there.

Neil Mick 06-26-2006 11:58 AM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Mark Uttech wrote:
another puzzling poll... I answered 'yes' because the majority of the popular martial arts put you in a cage, and I didn't want to go in there.

Yep...totally in agreement with you, on this one.

billybob 06-26-2006 12:52 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
I answered 'No'.

All martial arts are based on the human body. There are no secret techniques, no hidden principles, no magic - just ourselves and the world around us to discover. Aikido is not 'special' in and of itself,
only in that it points us to the sublime truth - which is life.

david

dps 06-26-2006 01:04 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

David Knowlton wrote:
only in that it points us to the sublime truth - which is life.

Yes, life can be very sublimy. :p

Kevin Leavitt 06-26-2006 01:07 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
No.

Jonathon Han: You studying bua gua with Bob Galeone by chance?

Back years ago he worked on foot work and weight shifting a great deal with us when he ran the dojo.

Dirk Hanss 06-26-2006 04:43 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
I just visited a siminar last weekend.
We did not perform a lot of techniques but were told (again) about aikdo principles
Some like "stay protected", "move calmly", "do not try to survive, but just do the best you can, as you know, you must die", "keep your body straight ", "keep your mind in the hara", and a lot more.

At the end sensei said: "I did not give them numbers, because in fact they are all the same and one principle 'kokyu'."

Now if kokyu is the only principle of aikido, it is the principle of most budo segments. If kokyu is not the principle of a martial art, it is not budo.

In short words: my answer is no.

I usually don't like joining the majority, but if they are right, I have no choice ;)

Dirk

Mark Freeman 06-27-2006 05:22 AM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
I have to go along with Mark and Neil on this one. Although the question asks specifically about 'physical' principles, not psychological or philosophical. Surely the the aim of protecting your assailant from harm puts aikido at odds with the majority of martial arts out there?

regards,

Mark

billybob 06-27-2006 10:02 AM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Mark Freeman said
Quote:

Surely the the aim of protecting your assailant from harm puts aikido at odds with the majority of martial arts out there?
Maybe it is out of self interest. Even the thug who likes watching fallen enemies bleed out knows that he will go to jail if caught.

Someone I know once said of a poor person who walked by "Wouldn't waste a bullet on him."

We don't hang out too much anymore.

dave

Dirk Hanss 06-27-2006 10:45 AM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Just a reminder:
The question was "not present in any other budo". It is not ask about the majority. So if you think, you can find ONE budo discipline, teaching the same principle - maybe in a different way, the answer should be "NO".

And cage fight is NOT budo. There is no DO and 'though they are fighting seriously, it is more for entertainment, than 'martial' or 'protective', however you interprete BU.

Dirk

dps 06-27-2006 12:05 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Mark Freeman wrote:
Surely the the aim of protecting your assailant from harm puts aikido at odds with the majority of martial arts out there?Mark

On the other hand the primary aim of Aikido is to protect yourself against your assailant which is the goal of all martial arts.

Mark Uttech 06-27-2006 12:34 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
I disagree again. The primary aim is not protecting yourself. Defending yourself by instinct is a primary natural indulgence. Chimpanzees do it. Other animals do it. Other martial artists do it.
But an aikidoka is a missionary. Everything becomes part of the practice. Takemusu Aiki, and so forth and so on. Aikido continually returns to the question: "Now what?"

billybob 06-27-2006 01:32 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Mark Uttech said
Quote:

I disagree again. The primary aim is not protecting yourself. Defending yourself by instinct is a primary natural indulgence. Chimpanzees do it. Other animals do it. Other martial artists do it.
But an aikidoka is a missionary. Everything becomes part of the practice. Takemusu Aiki, and so forth and so on. Aikido continually returns to the question: "Now what?"
Mark, please define 'self'.

david

dps 06-27-2006 04:33 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

Mark Uttech wrote:
The primary aim is not protecting yourself.

Would you let your assailant beat you in order to protect him?

Mark Freeman 06-27-2006 05:36 PM

Re: Poll: Does aikido contain any physical principles not present in any other budo?
 
Quote:

David Skaggs wrote:
On the other hand the primary aim of Aikido is to protect yourself against your assailant which is the goal of all martial arts.

I believe the 'primary' aim of aikido is not self protection, but a practice to achieve harmony with ki/lifeforce/universal energy, inherent in the name ai-ki-do Self protection is a by-product of the practice.

regards,

Mark


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