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The Vic.... 05-22-2007 04:59 AM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Quote:

Alison Macdiarmid wrote: (Post 129384)
Hi

I sometimes practice with Sensei Eve and I must say her club is excellent if anyone is thinking of going along. I have practiced in several styles in the UK and Europe and have found that the Ki Federation have relatively high amount of ladies ranking 5th Dan and above.

Light n love Ali

Hi Alison. Is Senei Eve's dojo in Glasgow?

jennifer paige smith 05-23-2007 08:56 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Quote:

Szczepan Janczuk wrote: (Post 167413)
I think woman need a solid judo/jj background to do high quality aikido. I believe it should be a requirement to avoid aikido being watered down. And your proposed way of practice, George, leads to such sad state of matters. Simply put, you propose to ajust standards down.

High majority of woman are very afraid of solid physical contact or of receiving strong technique. Even if aikido is not an activity with much contact, female aikidoka psychicaly reject it, and I can't see any method to teach it better then i.e. judo does it.

One day during seminar in South France, I was very pleased to practice with Michelle from Spain(Barcelona I believe) one of very rare women with real budo spirit. Later I learned she had jj background. It gave also idea to cross train in judo for my wife. Few years later I still can't believe, how she changed, her aikido became absolutly amazing.

To my mind this statement is about 'what is valued' and what is acknowleged as valuable in our collective world. A world where the feminine has been rejected and the masculine over emphasized. Out of balance. The answer is to expand our vision of training and what it is for, to develop appropriate muscle and physical use among all players; not to tell Women what they must do to qualify in a masculine model of our art. This aiki is a do, a tao, how the water flows. Only natural that water depth should be involved as it spreads through many bodies. Not neccesarily 'down'. ,but perhaps through or with.

Mark Uttech 05-26-2007 05:29 AM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
In the aftermath of WWII, when Japan was a defeated nation, it found a little hope in the admonishment of a buddhist priest to simply take care of itself the way it would raise a child; what was not good for the child was not good.

In gassho,

Mark

jennifer paige smith 05-26-2007 10:17 AM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
In the mid 1960's, Bob Frager Sensei was driving through Tokyo in a Taxi with O'Sensei. He thought to himself 'here I am with the founder alone. Maybe I can ask just one question.' He pondered the thought for a moment with full knowledge that this was a precious opportunity, if the question was allowed at all. He weighed his words carefully and asked "Sensei, what should the attitude of nage be toward uke?". Without a pause O'Sensei answered, "Like a parent to a child.".

Jen

Ewan Wilson 12-12-2007 08:15 AM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Quote:

George S. Ledyard wrote: (Post 94358)
Thanks! I have added her name to my list of teahers world wide who are 7th Dan and up. I must say it's a big deal for anyone to get that highly ranked, I would think your website would have a bit more about her. I had to dig before I found her name in there..
- George

Maybe they don't think it's particularly important.

Basia Halliop 12-12-2007 12:20 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Quote:

To my mind this statement is about 'what is valued' and what is acknowleged as valuable in our collective world. A world where the feminine has been rejected and the masculine over emphasized.
I don't think I could disagree more strongly! I don't much appreciate another person (woman or man) defining for _me_ what kind of attitude is 'feminine' and 'masculine', and therefore what I 'should' value or 'should' relate to or 'should' feel at home with or familiar with as a woman, never mind that it completely rejects a significant subset of women (and probably of men too). I got out of highschool in hopes of finally seeing the back end of that and being free to just be myself, and I don't want it creeping back in my Aikido world.

I have to say I agree much more with Szczepan's advice. Teach women to be comfortable and confident in their bodies and their muscles and have more trust in their own physical power and capabilities.

Basia Halliop 12-12-2007 12:33 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Oops - it appears this thread was dead. Darn, I didn't mean to help resucitate it.

Ron Tisdale 12-12-2007 12:58 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
No Problem from me, I like what you said!

Best,
Ron

George S. Ledyard 12-12-2007 05:25 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Just as aside, since this came up again... This was the single most replied to piece I ever wrote (and that's a fair bit between Aikido Journal, Aiki Web and E-Budo).

I got e-mails from women all over the English speaking world... It was re-printed in a Karate organization's newsletter. It was the focus of a spirited discussion on a Women's Martial Art site. Obviously, it struck a chord. Opinions seemed strongly held on this one. But I think that there is a broad common experience which many, obviously not all, women identify with. I find that fact to be a cause for reflection. Sort of the "50 million Elvis fans can't be wrong" idea... I don't think the My Fair Lady "Why can't a woman be more like a man?" approach is going to be very satisfying in the long run.

Shany 12-13-2007 03:32 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
George, you wrote about the Dan system and women being 'less' than the boys.
but, in fact, why would anyone really care about grading system? its not really important unless u wanna show it around and boost the ego.

women, being physically less stronger, has way better technique than guys, who usually measure their techniques with physical power.

why no girls have really stood up? i think because no one lets them or society makes it such that they automatically not worthy of teaching.

Lorien Lowe 12-19-2007 04:29 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Heya all-
I just finished a book relevant to this topic, called Training Women in the Martial Arts, by Jennifer Lawler and Laura Kamienski. It offers a good look at why a lot of women come into the martial arts in the first place, and talks about how to support them and how to keep them in the dojo. The book is written strictly from a woman's perspective and is strictly for women in the sense that its entire goal is to help women begin and continue training, and couldn't care less about keeping the average Joe in the dojo (based on the assumption that he has a lot of cultural advantages to doing so already).

A lot of the focus of the book is on women's self-defense classes, and the need for classes that address attacks on women by people whom they know (statistically, something like 85% of rapes) and the need for self-defense for women who might be reluctant to gouge the eyes or break the elbows of men whom they know, until it's too late for them to resist effectively.

I'm going to add this book to the dojo library, but would like to offer the caveat that it is written from a strong feminist perspective that might offend some male readers. The existence of a patriarchy, both within and without martial arts, is taken as a given - as is the negative effects of said patriarchy on the women of the world.

ps I'll repost this over in book reviews too.

onishin 03-10-2008 06:46 AM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Hi

While reading this thread i came across a list of high ranking women in aikido. At least I think it is.. as I don't speak Russian

http://www.daobg.com/forum/lofiversi...php/t8846.html

akiy 03-10-2008 10:43 AM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Quote:

Diogo Almeida wrote: (Post 201312)
Hi

While reading this thread i came across a list of high ranking women in aikido. At least I think it is.. as I don't speak Russian

http://www.daobg.com/forum/lofiversi...php/t8846.html

The above page refers to information which is currently being collected here on AikiWeb in its AikiWiki page on "High Ranking Female Yudansha" page:

http://www.aikiweb.com/wiki/Highrankingwomen

As always, if folks here see anyone that should be added, please use the "edit" function on that page to update. Thanks!

-- Jun

Mary Turner 03-16-2008 07:27 PM

Re: Women and Everybody Else in Aikido
 
Quote:

No more should we encounter the dojo which places the male students at the top of the technical and hierarchical heap while the women, all ranked in the second tier, do all of the organizational and administrative work thereby actually keeping the school going for the men. No more should we recognize the accomplishments of women only to the extent that they resemble those of the men but also for the unique contributions they can make which perhaps most of the men can't or won't.
Thank you, thank you! I get so tired of being the one to keep up with the paperwork, clean the Kamiza, etc.

Great article.


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