Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
I'll do you a favor and presume to judge: Aikikai has basically preserved the external form of Aikido, and to some extent, the spirit of it. However, the passing of Aikido lineage through Osensei's child Kisshomaru and grandson Moriteru, was a bad call in my opinion. With all due respect, neither of these guys' Aikido has ever been pointed to as even close to Osensei, or even Tohei or Tomiki. They are beaurocratic figureheads of the Aikikai organization, not top form Aikidoka. Tohei sensei on the other hand was granted 10th dan by Osensei and he ended up being the ONLY Osensei approved 10th Dan. (tons of 10th Dans after tohei left, but these seemed more like political promotions) Why the big split? politics. I can't help but wonder whether Kisshomaru was jealous of Tohei's favoured ranking and position within Aikikai as given to him by Osensei. I have no evidence, but all I know is, the top ranked Aikidoka in the world was 'pushed out' as head instructor, which was fine, because he just made his own Aikido school. But the result? Now there are some fantastic Aikidoka on both sides of the fence, but there is not a whole lot of reintegration of the two schools, but a lot of mutual critique and criticism based on ignorance and the all pervasive, 'fear of the unknown'. Resulting in the comments by Mr. Eric Mead :circle: :square: :triangle: |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
|
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
Quote:
Why speak of the moon if I have not visited? I would do a disservice not to flag the areas where I am speculating from those in which I have sound experience to make a conclusion. That does not mean that interpolation of the gaps in knowledge is not useful, nor that it is necessarily incorrect. I observe, and I analyze, and I speak; it is my curse, really. (And my stock in trade, for that matter ...) Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
And "Erick" is spelled with a "ck" -- just so you know, (I'm used to it.) :D |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Dear Alfonso and Eric,
I've seen videos of them doing randori and such, and they seem pretty uncoordinated and shaky (just search the names on youtube) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3OIKnG1L5k here, take a look at Osensei, and Tohei sensei (and even Shioda sensei) and compare them to any video of Ueshiba's kids. They don't even hold a candle to Osensei or Tohei Sensei. It's not just a 'he's better' argument, it's rational acknowledgement that being a great martial artist's son does not automatically make you great. Osensei himself said something to the effect of 'this budo is not inherited' or the like, this was a powerful statement as at the time most schools of jujitsu and what not were passed down through family generations. Anyway, I'm basically setting the record straight regarding the implied accusations you made about tohei sensei and the ki society being, whatever it is you claim they were being. It was Osensei's will that Tohei sensei head the Aikikai. Tohei, being a nice guy, decided to leave when more conservative mindsets and political forces amassed to give him guff. So my point Eric, is: Tohei sensei IS the 'middle ground' of Aikido. What is currently called the Aikikai is not even close to being as great as it could have been, and it is NOT what Osensei envisioned. |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
"As soon as you concern yourself with the "good" and "bad" of your fellows, you create an opening in your heart for maliciousness to enter. Testing, competing with, and criticizing others weaken and defeat you."
-O'Sensei This bickering about who is better than who is pointless and destructive. |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
Exactly! My friends include Yoshinkan, Tomiki, AAA, Aikikai, etc. teachers and sniping at each other woukd be such a huge waste of time. We more in common than not. These are my Aikido brothers. After all most people I encounter think I mean some form of karate. The most common question is. "is that like Tae Kwon Do ?" As for this threads question. huh? For anything that someone loves you can be sure to find someone that hates it. Why tickle even two brain cells together about it. It's inevitable the more common something is to find someone who hates it. Everyone find a path you enjoy and to hell with what anyone else thinks. Love it with a passion. :ki: |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Can't we all just get along!!!!!!!!
|
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
Thanks for the support Joseph. |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
Its pointless saying 'my instructor is fantastic' or 'my style is the best', if you yourself are crap. We just have to be the best we can be; whether that means exploring other styles, of even other martial arts. The relationship to Budo and martial development must be the real test.... and we will argue over that for ever! ;) |
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Quote:
The quoted material in your initial post was to the point of observation, acceptance, and declaration of personal preference. Your following reply contained nothing but ideas directly disdained and rejected by Joseph Montange's quoted material. Calm Down, Tomorrow is Friday, you can have a cookie then. |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
|
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Quote:
2) I think Joseph can speak for himself. 3) I am calm, are you? 4) Tomorrow IS friday, the one thing you got right. 5) Thanks for the patronizing "cookie". Could you explain to me how that isn't smug and condescending. Or are you unapologetic? |
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Something of a tangent:
There are these 3 clips of Tohei sensei on Youtube at the moment, and in one of them he shows striking a bokken corectly and incorrectly. (7:30 in http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfpTU6ZiaK4) There is also an Aikikai video (not on Youtube) featuring Kisshomaru doshu, with Shibata, Seki, Moriteru, Endo, Suganuma, and Chiba senseis as ukes. In one part Chiba sensei is thrusting at Kisshomaru with jo, and Kisshomaru doshu strikes the jo with bokken in such a way that Chiba sensei drops to his knees. I just thought is was interesting you could see them do something so similar in light of this thread. |
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Quote:
|
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
So where does Gozo Shioda Sensei fit in on the pecking order?
|
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I think I'm having a bit of that cathartic aggression Erick might have been referring too. Look closer and maybe you'll gain some sort of benefit from your tantrums. |
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Quote:
|
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Quote:
|
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
The things that Tohei Sensei wanted to introduce to Aikido was not learned from O'Sensei but from the Tempukai, hence the dissatisfaction of this idea from Kisshomaru and the other high ranking Sensei. |
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Hi folks,
Please stop the personal attacks. They are not welcome here on AikiWeb. Thank you, -- Jun |
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Wow, that is unmitigated, irrevocable logic, and in only 4 syllables. I got nothing, Thread Over, you win.
|
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Not very Aiki.
|
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
Quote:
I think if you're a little more open and kind to new posters, and try not to be so snide and condescending with your posts, you'll find yourself in a lot more friendly dialogue and a lot less of what just happened. take it to heart. --WW |
Re: Why do some people hate Aikido?
Quote:
|
Re: K. Tohei vs Aikikai
I second Jun's post. This is one of the most un-aiki threads I've ever read on Aikiweb. Right from the title, too. There should be no "vs" in Aikido, especially between aikidoka/aikidoists. As one of my favourite dojo rules goes: "leave your shoes and your egos off the mat".
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:46 AM. |
Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.