Re: Guns?
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Also, Japanese are often more comfortable with seemingly incompatible positions than westerners are. For example, several of his young students after the war got into a brawl with members from another dojo. After scolding them severely he went up to one of the students and said something along the lines of "OK, so how many did you get?". Kisshomaru, FWIW, stated flatly that his father was not a pacifist. Best, Chris |
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Drew |
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Best, Chris |
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Drew |
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searched, but did not find what you mean. Would you care to elaborate?? Best, Ron |
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Pacifism is a belief. A belief that peaceful resolution of conflict is correct resolution of conflict. People who I think of as anti-pacifists often (though not always) think that the motive behind pacifism is cowardice. Not being willing to stand up for your rights. I personally believe that's kind of wrong-headed itself since pacifists often have to put up with a lot of abuse in order to defend their own belief. But, in general, I think it's a mistake to read too much of a person's motive for belief from the belief itself. The action resulting from pacifism is more salient, I think. Being opposed to conflict necessarily means that you will avoid conflict when it is possible. But a realistic pacifist will realize that not everyone is a pacifist and that it is therefore necessary to resolve violent conflict sometimes. When someone throws a punch at you, you need to do something about it. Standing there and taking the punch might not help (I was going to say "doesn't help", but I know of at least one situation in my own life where it *did* help, so...). I think another mistake that both pacifists and anti-pacifists make is believing that pacifism and passiveness are synonyms. I really believe this may be the source of a lot of confusion on the subject. |
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I don't really suffer from that delusion...look at Ghandi and MLK Jr...they both were all about conflict, confrontation, etc. The difference was in HOW they did those things...and WHAT they did when those conflicts and confrontations led to violence by others.
Best, Ron |
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Good thing it wasn't a firearm. :eek: |
Re: Aikido and Pacifism
Lol :)
B, R |
Re: Aikido and Pacifism
Excellent post, Michael, a perfect or as near perfect parsing out of people's confusion on the topic of pacifism and passiveness.
The following is from Bronson Diffin's signature, it is my favorite line on the topic: Quote:
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Anyhow, Good Post! michael. |
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Who was it that said something like "A true pacifist is someone who, with skill and knowledge, can kill in the blink of an eye yet choose not to"
Brilliant quote:cool: :straightf |
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Yukiyoshi Takamura ...from about 3 posts up...
;) B, R |
Re: Aikido and Pacifism
Here is something to think about from a book I am reading.
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Based on this: Ghandi, MLK and the others in this category would be practicing nonviolence, not pacifism. Pacifism would be practiced by some like the Amish who choose to turn the other cheek and choose not to participate in the social structure that supports their lifestyle. That is, the choose to not playball and be non-active. Nonviolence confronts violence, it does not avoid it. |
Re: Aikido and Pacifism
Interesting quote...and viewpoint. Is there anything in particular about Mark Kurlansky that would add validity to his opinion?
Best, Ron |
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Dali Lama wrote the Forward to the book??
The Dali Lama had this to say in the last paragraph of his foreward: Quote:
Does that help Ron? |
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Not really...I guess I was hoping for a better idea of the writer...guess I should read the book! :D
B, R |
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I don't think he is anyone special in this field per se.
He has essentially written a bunch of books (nonfiction) that he has researched and written. Like "Salt: A world history" or "The Basque History of the World". Here is an Amazon link to the book. http://www.amazon.com/Nonviolence-Le...e=UTF8&s=books |
Re: Aikido and Pacifism
Ron, I think conceptually I agree with him. Although I suppose that would depend on your definition/parameters of pacifism vice nonviolence.
I can see validilty in his separation point based on action (nonviolence) versus no action (pacifism). I would tend to label aikido philosophy in the nonviolent realm vice pacifism. Aikido is not about avoiding violence, but approaching it skillfully. pacifism based on this definition is one in which aikido could not even exsist as a concept as it would be no-action...or simply standing their while you are attacked. I do think it is a key concept to discuss and understand. I had this conversation just yesterday with one of my Captains that works for me. He could not understand and thought I was hippocritical I suppose for being a Vegetarian, that believed in nonviolence, yet I was in the military. I had to explain the concept of pacifism versus non-violence. |
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And aside from that, in the strictest logical/gramatical treatment of the words involved: Pacifism VS Non-Violence; only pacifism actually allows for violence to occur, non-violence by logic implying the negative of violence. But yet again, one can argue that both terms represent a means for the negation of violence, The "no-action" category in which Kurlansky places pacifism, as far as I identify it (and, perhaps, Mr Riehle), would better contain the idea of passivism. English is rather screwy. My idea of pacifism is a state from which one is willing&able to enact will/force toward some end with only the violence necessary to resolve an event. e.g. no curb-jobs Kurlansky's idea of pacifism seems more to the point of simply screaming "Please, just not in the face! Not in the face!" I guess I'll have to read up on the origin of pacifism as a popular term. michael. P.S. Weren't the Marines partially founded by a Quaker, who are generally considered pacifist, if only because they've been around far longer than the term "non-violent". |
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Tony |
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A Pacifist is one who believes in Peace rather than War. Of course everyone says he believes in Peace, but if that were really true, we wouldn't run willy nilly into conflicts at the drop of a hat, which mankind clearly does.
The number of wars like WWII in which there is a clear demarcation between good and evil are few. Most wars are the result of maneuvering for position and influence in defense of the riches belonging to the top stratum of the societies in question (like WWI) and have no function or benefit to the poor folks involved. Sorry if this sounds very "Lefty"... so-called Socialist or Communist governments haven't been any better about this than anyone else so it's not really a left - right issue. In the words of Maj General Smedly Butler, the most decorated Marine in Corps history, "War is a racket". (He wrote an article by that title which can be found on-line. http://www.lexrex.com/enlightened/ar...risaracket.htm This is pretty much my view on War and that would make me basically a Pacifist. |
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Best regards Dirk |
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