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spinecracker 01-08-2005 12:24 PM

Real aikido question
In the 'Hello' forum, a gentleman mentioned that he is training in 'real' aikido. I checked out the website for the organization, and the founding individual is decribed as a 10th Dan.I'm not making any comments about the gentleman's abilities or qualifications, but does anyone know anything about 'real' aikido, the head instructor or the organization? (I'm pretty sure the stuff my sensei is doing is pretty real, too :D )

The organization's website is at

rob_liberti 01-08-2005 12:31 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Maybe it's just a poor language translation. I think he means His new style of aikido which he feels REALLY works. I don't know. Wasn't O-sensei talking about how he still was working on ikkyo when he died? It seems like some of these self-appointed 10th dans feel they passed him.


Noel 01-08-2005 06:27 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Neat. The shihan in Chicago is younger than me. Guess I'm washed up at 33.

Don 01-08-2005 06:50 PM

Re: Real aikido question
His certificates say nothing substantiative about his lineage. If his lineage traces back to one of O'Sensei's students let him show it. Without lineage, he may call it aikido, but its fakido. Otherwise it BS as far as aikido goes. It may be good self-defense, but its not aikido.

aikidoc 01-08-2005 07:53 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Here's the site I found. I have run across them before.

It's worth having your sound on to catch to sword cutting and barking dogs sound effects and the music in the intro.

This is from their website: "Real aikido is first and only Serbian ultimate fighting and self-defense martial arts. Real Aikido is efficient, widely applicable self-defense skill, derived from traditional aikido and jujitsu. The founder of Real Aikido is Grand Master Ljubomir Vracarevic, holder of the black belt, 10th Dan, professor of Real Aikido and Ju-jitsu. Thanks to his long experience acquired and improved by continuous contact with first-class Japanese masters of this skill, master Vracarevic distinguished several thousand techniques, purified them, reformed their elements, introducing in his own knowledge from other fighting skills, creating a new style Real Aikido - extremely efficient and flexible system of defense techniques. Flexibility of Real Aikido is just one of its most important characteristics. Putting together different techniques according to the real situation, maximal efficiency is achieved. Transition from one to another technique is simple, and only knowledge and skill will determine which elements someone will use. These unlimited possibilities of combining, enable multiple applies of Real Aikido."

Since I authored a "related" thread it is probably best I keep my mouth shut on this one. :).
I would say the site speaks for itself. I love the blue gi.

aikidoc 01-08-2005 08:08 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Follow the links:

He gives absolutely no background and the second link shows where the rank comes from.

I wonder what Westbrook and O'Ratti think about them copping some of their pictures.

aikidoc 01-08-2005 08:20 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Check the videos on the American link. It looks like pretty standard aikido stuff although varying styles with one noteable different. Most techniques end with a finishing atemi. So does that make it a new style? Hell, I use atemi all the time. Actually, the aikido is pretty good and aggressive. I guess I just get lost when we go to the 10th dan soke grandmaster stuff. Oh well, it's just me I guess. I'm too much a traditionalist. :crazy:

David Humm 01-09-2005 01:06 AM

Re: Real aikido question
lol.. Grandmaster 10th dan Soke...

it's <cough>Bullshit!</cough> :D

Tommy_S 01-09-2005 10:14 PM

Re: Real aikido question

jonreading 01-10-2005 12:55 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Uhh.... I appreciate the fact that sometimes innovative and fantastic martial artists can define a new martial art, but it does concern me that someone can simply walk up and create a new martial art.

I hope that the founder of the real aikido understands that their website does not support an aikido-defined lineage, certificates from a major aikido association or affiliation, or recognition from Aikido Hombu dojo.

I also hope that this support of legitiamicy has simply been overlooked and does exist, even if not online...

PeterR 01-10-2005 07:14 PM

Re: Real aikido question
I know an Aikikai Yondan that regularily trains with him (his first teacher). Said Yondan moves very well and swears by the guy.

The founder of Real Aikido really was a trainer to some very interesting folks.

Jorx 01-11-2005 03:22 AM

Re: Real aikido question
Well it's an eastern european thing.

This jugoslavian guy has some lineage but i do not remember exactly.

He was said to have really good aikikai-aikido when he was around 6th dan or so and under aikikai. He worked as a bodyguard-leader for some african leaders.

I've seen one of his instructionals. It was total crap imho. And I've worked with real-aikido students in estonia. They tend to be really stiff and "tough". Don't like it.

PeterR 01-11-2005 03:32 AM

Re: Real aikido question
I heard he isn't Dan ranked by any of the main organizations much less 6th Dan. Again the one student I know of his moves pretty well but I don't know who is responsible for that.

Tommy_S 01-11-2005 04:12 AM

Re: Real aikido question
I've heard various stories about this man (i don't now if these were true or not), and one of them was that he trained in Aikikai until he was 2nd dan or so, and after that all other ranks were self-promotions...

Peter Seth 01-11-2005 07:02 AM

Re: Real aikido question
'Real' Aikido MMMM? I Thought Aikido contained some Ai ? Looks a little like a jitsu/contact sort of thing? 'Removed some of the Japanese did he' MMMM? I always thought that the more experienced you became the less effort/contact you required? What is the philosophy associated with aikido? Is it harmony I wonder? 10th dan MMMM? Lots of questions????

philipsmith 01-13-2005 06:09 AM

Re: Real aikido question
I visit Belgrade annually to take a seminar. The "real Aikido" guy are always invited and never attend. I'll try to find out some more when I'm their in March.

nmrmak 05-16-2006 09:32 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Hello Philip, I've been to the seminar you held in Belgrade in April, it was very inspiring :-)

I've heard many different stories about Ljuba as well... It's no surprise he's a 10th dan when he promoted himself to that rank. If I made my own martial art tomorrow, that would make me a 10th dan in that are too, now wouldn't it? I doubt many people acknowledge his degree though.

Kevin Leavitt 05-17-2006 02:08 PM

Re: Real aikido question
No comments on the validity or anything since I don't know the gentleman in questions. There are probably many cultural issues that come into play that we in western europe and the U.S. don't appreciate.

I do find it intriquing "real aikido". Implies what??? there is a "fake aikido"?

nmrmak 05-17-2006 02:18 PM

Re: Real aikido question
No, it's not not "real" in that sense, the meaning of that word should be interpreted as "realistic" or "applicable". He does not imply that traditional aikido is fake, he's just saying that his version is of more use on the street.

Kevin Leavitt 05-17-2006 03:28 PM

Re: Real aikido question
Thanks for clarifying that Nebojsa.

RebeccaM 05-17-2006 03:51 PM

Re: Real aikido question
I'm pretty close to someone who used to train in Belgrade. He told me about this guy a while back and said while he did do some aikido a long time ago he never got very far and he's not taken very seriously. Even though he does, apparently, train Gadhafi's (sp?) bodyguards.

Jory Boling 05-17-2006 04:24 PM

Re: Real aikido question
At least the Chicago dojo is involved in the community and with an organization called "Women Against Rape." (at the time of a video that is on their website)

I wonder how much aikido is in Serbia,in addition to this guy.

Don_Modesto 05-17-2006 06:55 PM

Re: Real aikido question

Nebojsa Mrmak wrote:
I've heard many different stories about Ljuba as well... It's no surprise he's a 10th dan when he promoted himself to that rank. If I made my own martial art tomorrow, that would make me a 10th dan in that are too, now wouldn't it?

Actually, no. Osensei had no rank in aikido, neither did his son nor his son.

People claiming 10 DAN or going back to the original purpose of the KYU/DAN system, i.e., marketing.

Check out the Tohei interview where he is speed promoted to 9 and 10 in order to compete in the market with judo...

emma.mason15 05-17-2006 07:45 PM

Re: Real aikido question
we had a martial artist down here wo set up a .... for want of a better word "mcDojo". he claims he is a 10th dan in what he does. Unfortunatly for him its wide spread knowledge across the MA community that he was actually stripped of his ranks and exposed as a fraud!
bless ....
they still keep on comming!
:D :D :D

Leon Aman 05-18-2006 03:03 AM

Re: Real aikido question
Well, maybe "Real Aikido" in the title, World Centre of Real Aikido , is just a Name of that independent organization founded by a certain Grandmaster Vracarevic, and has nothing to do on his simple personal claim as being the promoter of real aikido.

And/or maybe the word "real" does not imply "real" in a real sense…… I am not really sure. But… one thing I definitely sure, is that aikikai is not a fake aikido.

………And because they are indefendent and Grandmaster Vracarevic 10th Dan - SOKE is the founder, therefore, he is entitled to this rank,,,, or whatever rank he wants to be. big deal.

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