aikido in your country's language
If you were going to rename aikido in the language of your country what would it be?
I like "Principles for Awareness and Safety." To me that is American for Aikido, incorpating self-defense and the spiritual side. |
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Even the weak can overcome the strong :-) Best Lars ( I know this is an academic discourse.. so no pun intended.. :-P and I apologise in advance off course :-D ) |
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Henry Ellis Co-author `Positive Aikido` http://britishaikido.blogspot.com/ |
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合気道: it does not need renaming here. :D
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My contribution: Dignity System |
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What Peter said.
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It is the way of aiki in what ever language you choose to name. The target is aiki, and the techniques provide the method to find it.
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I would call it "Der Aikido"
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You can write aiki romanized or in kanji. You can write it with greek letters or whatever. But it stays allway aiki. So we say "Der Weg des aiki". Renaming or "translating" this term allways will loose it's true meaning or understanding. |
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How are things? I think Japanese is commonly thought to be fairly flexible on how the elements of a compound word can be subdivided, especially for words like 合気, which are not in common use. I have had many discussions about this with Japanese colleagues who profess Japanese language and linguistics. Morihei Ueshiba does not use the term consistently and in terms of kotodama the term 合気道 could be broken down into its three elements, with each element given its own interpretation. I think the problem for Mary E (I am sure she will come back and correct me if I am wrong) is that 合気 and 合気道 lack a commonly accepted English translation and so need to be replaced by an acceptable definite description. As I stated in my earlier post, we do not need to do this here in Japan, since 合気 and 合気道 do just fine. Best wishes, PAG |
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I wouldn't try to give it a descriptive name or a name that tried to sum up what it was in the name. I'm quite happy to stick with a name that isn't descriptive in my language.
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The great thing about English is that it has no shame in borrowing words especially if there is no equivalent already there.
We borrowed beserk, amok - why not aiki. |
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Hi Guys,
Some Aikido on you tube should carry the name Ball Room Dancing as a substitute for Aikido.Another possible name isthe British pastime known as The Floral Dance.Cheers, Joe. |
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It began as "aikido" here, and nothing has happened to warrant any changes. Perhaps the name changes should signify how far from the original interpretations have proliferated. Zannen da.
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Or perhaps it is okay to talk about things. No changes have to be made... we can just have a conversation. Sometimes listening to what other people have to say helps me learn or think about a subject in a new way.
And Joe, what you had to say has nothing to do with the thread. Isn't Aikiweb about conversations? And Peter, thank you for how you put that... |
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I was taught that ‘Aikido’ broken down into its component parts could be translated as ‘the Way to Union with Ki’. However, while Ai and Do are replaced with Way and Union respectively, Ki has no substitute. Over time I have developed my own functional definition of Ki as power generated by correct feeling, which is engendered by a coordinated mind and body.
Therefore if I were to translate, ‘rename’ in the OP, Aikido into English I would say “the Way (Do) of Unifying (Ai) mind and body so as to experience the power of correct feeling (Ki).” Ron |
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I am now of the opinion that you could do Aikido for 50 years and simply, not be doing Aikido at all. |
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Yes, I remember we had a brief conversation at the Yoyogi Centre in Tokyo and, yes, I will certainly ask you what you have discovered when we next meet. Some of my Dutch friends are studying aiki and those who are members of the dojos I look after do so with my strong encouragement. The problem with waza, however, is that Morihei Ueshiba used them throughout his life. He might well have used them as vehicles for doing something else, but he still used them. The question then is: was he using the term in the commonly-accepted sense of 'techniques', or was his concept more inclusive? The 'Way of Harmonizing Ki'-type explanation / translation occurs on the Aikikai's website, but only in the English section. It is symptomatic of a way of thinking according to which it is thought necessary to have a nice, tidy explanation of how all the parts of a compound word written in Chinese characters fit together. People often do this with the constituent parts of a character and the temptation here is to believe that after you have gone through this procedure you have a deeper understanding of the word. I think the tendency is less common here and I think the reason is that compound words written in Chinese characters are just words, after all, with definite meanings, of the type you can find in the dictionary. Best wishes, PAG |
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Joe's statement pierces right through to the very core of the hermeneutic aspect: If you try to rename something that already has a name on it's own - maybe because this name is not easy to use or you don't undertand it or it does not belong to your world in which way ever - your renaming will only reflect your understanding of the renamed phenomenon. The new name will tell something about you. But not about the phenomenon itself. Quote:
At last: Every phrase given in this thread to "rename" aikidō - also yours, Mary, and Ron's - can mean/describe a different budō also or simply a certain way of life. None of them exclusively describes what aikidō is - in my eyes. |
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Wow Carsten..you are taking this a lot more seriously than I meant it. If you reread my first post you might see the lightness in the language I used.
Aikido is a fine name, really. Often people ask me what I do don't understand when I say Aikido...so I was just thinking on Aikiweb about how to explain it in American English in a few short words. The way of peace or the way of harmony really dos not seem to help them understand. |
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Unfortunate that you can't see the alternate usage of the word rename (translate) because you are missing the point of the thread. No one is looking to rename Aikido in the sense of "let's not use the word Aikido any more let's say ... instead." You and others have chosen to zero in on a single word in the OP and use your interpretation of its usage in order to prove a point. Others, Henry Ellis in particular, saw the point immediately and responded in a way that furthers the discussion as it was originally intended. Rupert - Thanks for your feedback. Your insistence that Aiki cannot be translated is just a way of metaphorically putting your head in the sand and making believe the discussion isn't there. Words aren't useless, they are tools for understanding. This is a discussion board, not the mat. It's a place where words are used in order to further understanding of this art that we all practice. Ron |
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To me waza is hooked to version and is only a tool to move past as a single focus. As a major focus waza ties one to the version being taught and slows the process of individual vision. Aiki and what it opens up should be the focus after initially getting past waza. As my friend John has noted....the levels are waza, movement, internal training and Aiki. I agree with Rupert....and what he sez fits with Johns progression. Most start with waza and never leave it. Add in some movement that is necessary to make the waza work in the training area............... Of course this has all been discussed many times here........with each of us remaining on the side of the discussion that we have always taken. I am ok with that. 40 years on I am still trying to polish my vision of Aikido...... Respectfully Irreverent Gary |
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I'm not sure, but maybe you didn't get my point.
I'm not talking about how to label aikidō. I don't care how to name it. I myself use terms like internal work or internal art, japanese budō, integration of in and yo and some more terms like that, when asked what I am teaching. The name/label "aikidō" is only important to me, when asked, to which ryū/school/line of tradition - whatever you call it - I belong. What I'm saying that you loose what - at least to my understanding - aikidō actually is, when you try to "explain it in a few short words". Whatever explanation/translation/periphrasis you will get, it will match you and your understanding of aikidō. But it will not match what aikidō is beyond your own experience and understanding. When I translated aikidō into "my own language" and condensed it into "a few short words" as a beginner, my words where fundamentally different from how I translated it some years later. And looking back now on both versions, I can only be indulgent my former me ... I didn't know anything back then ... "Like it is allways in life, I think." Mary, you are right: I did not get the lightness in your words. I think this is due to two reasons. First I mostly do not get the nuances of the foreign language. But sencond and more important I think, hermeneutics, translating, the usage of words ... all this, to me is a very serious issue. Our words, ours usage of words creates the world we live in. Ron, as I said, I wanted to refer to translating aikidō and did not mean to discuss a new label or something like that. I have the opinion that there are certain terms that cannot be translated i.e. brought into one's own language without loosing their meaning. A more easygoing example is "hakama". Sure there exist some German words which come near. But none of them really fits. None of them really says just unmistakeable "hakama". There simply is no such word because there is no such piece of clothing in our culture. Every German word would cut off the meaning of "hakama" that goes beyond our own culture. Accordingly we don't use the male ("der") or female ("die")definite article, which we have in German. But we use the neuter ("das") article, which indicates that there is no German equivalent for the foreign word: Die Hose (trousers) Der Hosenrock (pantskirt) Das hakama When you try to translate dō, you have to start with relating it to the dao in the chinese classics and to trace it's path from there to the usage in the japanese arts in general and the gendai budō in particular. When you try to translate ki, you have to follow a simliar route: How is it related to the qi mentioned in Chinese texts and practiced in Chinese arts? When you try to translate aiki, you have to talk about in and yo and their integration. Aswell as about the union of heaven-earth-man and a lot of other hings like that. Is the forumla "ki shin tai ichi" related to the work with and union of jin, qi and shen in Chinese arts? ... |
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