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Skribbles
03-08-2006, 05:14 PM
id just like to ask how many times in you've been hurt while training in aikido and how long you've been doing it?
like broken bones...seperated shoulders ect? also did it tend to happen more towards the beginning or after you had been training for awhile?

Adam Alexander
03-08-2006, 05:25 PM
Be careful who you take instruction from. If you trust the word of a person based on the color of their belt or because you like their personality, you could end up wishing that you never even heard of Aikido.

emma.mason15
03-08-2006, 05:48 PM
I did me shoulder in, pulling all the muscles along my shoulder and neck. I was off training for 4 weeks ... but thats all thats happened so far!

Amelia Smith
03-08-2006, 05:55 PM
I think that with more experience, I've become better at protecting myself and not getting injured. My worst injuries, in terms of time off the mat, were between about 2-5 years of training regularly (3rd and 2nd kyu). The worst was one overstretched set of foot ligaments, which made it impossible to sit seiza for 3 months or more. The most painful was an ongoing on-and-off lower back/hip/sciatica thing which I think I finally have under control. It's more chronic than acute, and was/is aggravated by taking too many breakfalls (but what fun I had!).

Mark Uttech
03-08-2006, 07:13 PM
I have only gotten injured badly a few times, but there is a phenomenon that goes with that: Before each injury there was a shining moment where I felt I could do anything.

Nick Simpson
03-08-2006, 07:54 PM
Before each injury there was a shining moment where I felt I could do anything.

That is a VERY good way of putting it.

I've had my left hand cut open twice, flesh wound first time, loss of tendon and nerves second time. Broken toe once from getting it stuck in the mats. Few bust lips and noses but thats all part of the fun and games. To be honest I wouldnt trade the experiances of the injuries for anything, they've given me some pretty brutal experiances/insights and have shaped the person that I am as well as my training ethos and indeed my general technique etc etc. Take the rough and learn from it, Im not an expert on budo, but im sure it wasnt meant to be an easy road...

Aristeia
03-08-2006, 08:33 PM
I've not really done anything serious at all at Aikido. Had one weird situation where I took a top ukemi the same way I had 100s of times before but for some reason it jarred my neck and I couln't move my head for a couple of days. But apart from that, pretty much injury free other than the odd mild wrist strain.

Aristeia
03-08-2006, 08:35 PM
Be careful who you take instruction from. If you trust the word of a person based on the color of their belt or because you like their personality, you could end up wishing that you never even heard of Aikido.

Hey Jean. Interesting point - I agree that often poor instruction makes for injuries. Both in terms of not knowing what is dangerous, and injuring people for the need to "show off" as instructor. I've witnessed both unfortunately. Care to flesh out your comment a little?

ikkitosennomusha
03-08-2006, 09:15 PM
I had a sensei who I would throw hard from time to time. I did not mean to and did not realize it until I noticed he was shamelessly trying to throw me so hard as if to try and hurt me to adjust an ego. Luckily I am a big boy and have had no serious accidents although it could happen to anyone at anytime.

It was typical of me to throw hard. I had to struggle not necessarily with control but rather a differential ratio. Being a bodybuilder with serious mass and strength yeilded a constant effort by me to be mindful and extrememly easy. I never muscled my way through a technique. The more refined my technique got, the more powerful I became without using any power at all. Because of my gurth, my centripetal force would be greater than that of someone smaller during a technique. This caused some issues.

So, I found myself in a rut not being able to express my technique and getting nothing out of training. What a dilema. I know well what an ego hound is and believe me, it was never in my heart to be that. Aikido is not a contest of strength. Aikido in principle is invariant and the difference comes about in how each aikidoka conveys their interpretation. My problem was one of physics, nothing more. I was uncomfortable everytime I trained. No one understood me. Yes, I was not a normal guy in stature. When I would travel and visit dojos, the sensei would always love to call on me for ukemi because they wanted to test their technique against me with the attitude that if I can take this guy down, aikidomust work. They always tried to prove this by me.

Well, that is not what aikido is about. I was cooperative. I would show minimal resistance and go along with it out of respect. Most people could not get their hands around my wrist. Aikido is powerful and it works but at the same time I knew I could take the guy apart if I wanted. What does one do? I was at a camp and the director of the organization was seiza in front of me. I was grabbing his wrists. We were doing a balancing thing to make your center like a stump. I eventually let him shove me over out of respect knowing that I could have powered through him.

My point to all this is this, life is not fair to some. With my aikido knowledge and genetic makeup, alot are at a disadvantage. I try to level things out by being more cooperative than need be. Is this the thing to do? SHould I fall down for a superior rank because of the rank or perform to my ability? I have not figured this out yet and this would make for some added discussion on the good thread.

I once trained with a female at a seminar. She was complaining that everyone in the group was weak and not training hard enough. So, I though that was my cue to treat her normally. After I threw her once, she started complaing that I was throwing her too hard and she switched groups. Apparently, there is no happy medium.

SeiserL
03-08-2006, 09:15 PM
While I have hurt my shoulders, wrist, back, and knee during my time in training, I attribute it most just to the mileage that I have added up in life. Training is just where it all started catching up with me.

Dajo251
03-08-2006, 10:27 PM
never anything bad, bumps bruises, mat burns, a couple of broken toes, and once a dislocated finger

David Kai
03-08-2006, 10:55 PM
So, we're talking injuries. I, myself, am rather accident prone ... and also hyperflexibe, which doesn't help.

While studying Yoseikan Aiki Budo in Quebec, I managed to break my hand during a demonstration and I managed to CRUSH my big toe kicking what was supposed to be a matted wall ... turned out to be so worn out that it was more or less just a covered cinderblock. During that same time frame, I also managed to hyper-extend one of my ankles during a break fall. By taking the pressure off of one foot, I managed to wear out the other ankle very quickly. This is something that acts up every winter with a dull ache in my ankles.

During the last 10 years of Aikido training, I have had a few injuries. I had a concusion that hospitalized me. Funny though, I only grazed the mat with the utmost gentleness. It just happened to be at the perfect angle to mess with my head two days later as I was vomiting everywhere.

About 4 years ago, I did a full dislocation on my left elbow. The tissue scaring and secondary joint issues took about 2.5 years to clear up. 1-handed Aikido was in order for about 6 months.

Last April, I re-tore my hip-flexor taking the ukemi for a ude garami (cross arm throw). Sounds odd?!? I was born with bad hips and the regular ukemi puts too much pressure on the hip. I have another ukemi that I use, but I was at a seminar and nage was fustrated with my ukemi ... so he threw really hard and I couldn't make the adjustment I needed. Maybe, I should have said something first!?!

The only advice I would have to anybody who is looking to protect themselves is stretch, stretch, stretch, and don't let your ego stand in the way of asking, "How do I take this ukemi at my level?"

BenDuckett
03-08-2006, 11:23 PM
Mike,

"Interesting point - I agree that often poor instruction makes for injuries." :D

I've had one mild shoulder separation, nothing too bad so far (I did a bad ukemi from a throw from my Instructor. And yes, Mike was that Instructor!)
Not to worry, I had far worse in my Judo days.
Ben
p.s. Mike did say he felt bad about it!

Lan Powers
03-08-2006, 11:43 PM
Broken toe about two months into training. Minor joint tweeks and hyperextensions since over several years span, but nothing that hasn't faded with care and time.
Takes quite a bit more time now than it ever has before though.......46 this Sept.
Lan

Aristeia
03-09-2006, 12:28 AM
Mike,

"Interesting point - I agree that often poor instruction makes for injuries." :D

I've had one mild shoulder separation, nothing too bad so far (I did a bad ukemi from a throw from my Instructor. And yes, Mike was that Instructor!)
Not to worry, I had far worse in my Judo days.
Ben
p.s. Mike did say he felt bad about it!

Who are you! I've never heard of you before! :crazy:

To be fair I wasn't instructing at the time?

Dirk Hanss
03-09-2006, 03:25 AM
hurt: to cause emotional pain or anguish to : OFFEND
every time my technique does not work as it should. That happens several times per class and it is ALWAYS uke's FAULT

hurt: to inflict with physical pain
happens regularily, bad ukemi, strong technique, each nikyo, sankyo, yonkyo hurts (on my level). Stretching hurts. Aikido is pain, if you want to get forward. My personal SM studio ;)

hurt: damage or injure
once: both still beginners, with some MA background. I (uke) tried to take ukemi, when being unbalanced in shihonage, Nage did not let me go so some 85 kg hung at my bent wrist, which was not used to that. Nothing was broken, but it took weeks until I could use my left hand for strong grips and even after several months from time to time I could not hold a grip, I had to let go quite early.

Ho long I am training? Some 8 years in total.

Dirk

UnholyFracas
03-09-2006, 03:54 AM
Thankfully I've never had any major injuries. *crosses fingers*

I have a trapped nerve in my neck which was bought on by doing ukemi head first; straight down in to the mat like a pile driver! The sheer number of times I've whacked my head since :rolleyes: I probably have a skull like Jackie Chan's. Any excuse for a neck massage. ;)

There's an interesting collection of popping sounds in my hips and right ankle but that's a percussion section rather than an injury...

Gabriella Wrigholm
03-09-2006, 10:51 AM
I've never broken any bones during Aikido class but I have hurt my knees when being thrown in koshinage. And I recently got sort of dropped i the middle of a breakfall and hurt my leg in some way I don't understand. So I have to rest it for a few weeks. But it will be fine. Other than that I've never really been hurt and hope to keep it that way. :)

//Gabriella

Ben Eaton
03-09-2006, 10:58 AM
I've never had anything major, but I did cut my toe on my partner's toenail. That and burnt the top of my foot sliding out of a breakfall on the mat.

Moral of the story - cut your toenails! And don't drag the tops of your feet across the mat at speed. :p

Ron Tisdale
03-09-2006, 11:08 AM
Were you hurt or were you injured? ;)

Various bumps, bruises and cuts, grade 2 sprain of the mcl, various shoulder and knee issues, just got tendonitus of the supraspinatus tendon (mostly better now).

What I really hate is being responsible for someone else's injury. Most of mine I did to myself.

Best,
Ron

Karen Wolek
03-09-2006, 11:16 AM
Knee sprain, elbow sprain, elbows hyperextended a few times, toe sprains, hand/pinkie sprain, broken nose (cartilege fracture), and a lot of bumps, bruises, mat burns, toe/fingernail cuts from others.

I am now a lot less accident-prone that I used to be, though. I think my ukemi has improved A LOT and I'm more aware of what's going on as nage and as uke.

Nothing that kept me off the mat for more than a day or so, except the knee sprain. THAT I should have rested right away, but didn't....so it took 5 months to finally heal after on again/off again practice. The nose I broke in an AM class, got x-rays taken that afternoon, and drove straight to the dojo for class after leaving the hospital. OK, that was not my most brilliant move. <grin>

Oh, and I've been doing aikido for about 3 1/2 years.

Qatana
03-09-2006, 11:53 AM
Partially dislocated my shoulder in my second class, trained one-handed for a while. Broke my toe when it got caught in my partner's gi.

Kev
03-09-2006, 12:13 PM
I've noticed a lot of broken toes resulting from the puzzle mats, at least 1 every two weeks at the karate dojo where I train. I was the victim this past week, breaking the middle (how that happened?) toe on my left foot.

markwalsh
03-09-2006, 03:34 PM
Is there anyone out there who has been training for over 5 years and hasn't had an injury?

[Currently figuring out how to do aikido without raising arms to head... ]

Aristeia
03-09-2006, 03:43 PM
If it helps the one injurish thing that happened to me (slight neck sprain) probably happened after about 8 years.

crbateman
03-09-2006, 04:07 PM
Nothing more than bumps, bruises, sprains and scratches directly from Aikido practice, although I have severely aggravated pre-existing injuries numerous times. Just comes with the territory. Nothing even close to the things that happened to me in TKD, when I was much younger, but also more stupid. I was a walking pile of scar tissue. My nickname was "Puzzle Man" because I was constantly getting myself put back together again. Still paying for it some 20 years later.

"We can rebuild him... We have the technology..."

Lorien Lowe
03-09-2006, 09:03 PM
one sprained foot from someone landing on it and one partially separated shoulder from a bad fall (the latter totally my fault), both at brown belt level.

-LK

Aristeia
03-09-2006, 09:39 PM
here's a question. How many of these injuries have happened on crowded vs non crowded mats? Obviously crowded mats run the risk of people being thrown into each other, but also people trying to adjust their ukemi mid flight to avoid same.

Skribbles
03-09-2006, 10:09 PM
i havnt gotten hurt yet *knock on wood* my gf did... she was suppose to throw her legs out from under her but i guess one got stuck and she landed on it.. ended up breaking some bone in her foot

once her foots all better we're gonna start stretching every morning and working on our overall fitness
its been about 2 months now and shes almost able to walk on it again... figure another couple weeks and she can start walking... then maybe a month or so use it like normal but hey im no doc so *shrugs*

besides i figure we can work on stretching everyday and get to the point that instead of taking ukemi our body just turns to rubber and we can just stand there... lol jk

thanks for all the replies =)

GaiaM
03-09-2006, 11:42 PM
I've been training about six years and I've never had anything more major than mat burn, slightly strained wrists and knees. Nothing that kept me off the mat for more than a day or two.

I believe that severe injuries (one that keep people out of training) are a sign of a poorly run dojo. There is no need for people to get hurt on a regular basis - it is the job of the sensei and senior students to keep people safe by watching their interactions and attitudes and being good role models.

Gaia

Bronson
03-10-2006, 01:58 AM
Separated the AC joint in my right shoulder a few months in. I didn't do it in class but at work attempting a kneeling roll :rolleyes:

A couple of broken toes, mostly from getting caught between the mats. Mat burns, small cuts, jammed thumbs, head bumps and general achiness are all par for the course.

The most long lasting injury I've had happened when I was kneeling on one knee with my toes in what we would call "live" position, when a rather large fellow landed on my heel. Doctor said I overstretched the ligaments and would probably get arthritis. That was almost two years ago and I've got an appointment for next week to see a podiatrist because the pain has recently come back with a vengeance :(

Bronson

Nick Simpson
03-10-2006, 08:00 AM
I believe that severe injuries (one that keep people out of training) are a sign of a poorly run dojo. There is no need for people to get hurt on a regular basis - it is the job of the sensei and senior students to keep people safe by watching their interactions and attitudes and being good role models.

In a perfect world, but Sh*t happens...

justinmaceachern
03-10-2006, 08:13 AM
You see it is funny. I never actually gotten hurt on the matts in my dojo. You see i was given a gift of falling gracefully, now sometimes it hurts when i go down and am put in an arm lock, but as far as getting hurt from the fall almost never. But when i am training with my freind in his basement there is no mercy, and sometimes i get hurt.

Kon Asplundh
03-10-2006, 04:17 PM
Which brings up the question, what is the acceptable level of injurys for a dojo?
Kon

Qatana
03-10-2006, 04:58 PM
[QUOTE=Brian Dunlap]
besides i figure we can work on stretching everyday and get to the point that instead of taking ukemi our body just turns to rubber and we can just stand there... lol jk

QUOTE]

A real good way for you to experience the joys of having Sensei change the technique to something that Will make you fall. I walked out of an iriminage once and ended up pinned in yonkyo.

Adam Alexander
03-10-2006, 05:17 PM
Which brings up the question, what is the acceptable level of injurys for a dojo?
Kon

Seems like you'd have to take it on a case-by-case basis. Although I've been hurt severely enough to take me off the mat for a little while over a half-dozen times, only once would I say that it was due to someone else.

Seems like it'd have a lot to do with the group. I visited a dojo once where injuries were very common. They didn't spend more than five minutes on breakfalls. But, they all seemed happy. LOL. I wouldn't get on that mat for anything.

tenshin_uke
03-10-2006, 05:44 PM
crunched my shoulder, but was back in a couple of weeks. knee sprain and peroneal tendonitis in my ankle, but that's just part of the training.

Dillon
03-12-2006, 07:09 PM
Not counting bangs, bruises, sprains and scrapes, I've only actually been injured in the aikido dojo once. A fellow student applied kote mawashi too quickly, and my wrist basically came apart. Not a lot of fun, but it comes with the territory.

Jory Boling
03-12-2006, 10:43 PM
a fellow did the technique where they almost go into seiza at the last moment at your feet. i was slow in diving over him and my foot was left behind. it was somehow twisted. later, that ankle was pretty swollen. that was over a year ago. i couldn't do tenkan smoothely for several months and now i still feel it occasionally. i still don't know what exactly is going on inside there.

ruthmc
03-13-2006, 05:22 AM
Isn't it interesting how the majority of injuries seem to occur in the person taking ukemi?

My theory is that ukemi skills are not sufficiently encouraged in many dojo, leading to a mindset that "throwing people is the fun part" and "ukemi is a necessary evil". As a result, people work a lot on perfecting their techniques and very little on improving their ukemi.

I have had numerous disagreements with instructors about why this is allowed to happen. They say that they have to encourage beginners to come back, so they prefer to teach them techniques as they believe that beginners will not be so motivated by learning ukemi...

Personally I think that learning to fly is fun! When I started Aikido classes I was always very impressed by those students who could take good ukemi. Never thought I'd ever be able to do it myself though :) Those who were good at applying technique did not impress me so much, as I thought that would be easier to learn :D

More than 14 years later, I haven't changed my opinions a lot, although I now know that both ukemi and nagemi are difficult to learn well!

Ruth (numerous injures all caused by poor ukemi skills on my part)

Nick Simpson
03-13-2006, 05:25 AM
Ruth, I couldnt agree more with you. Excellent post.

Amelia Smith
03-13-2006, 06:46 AM
Yes, most of the injuries I've seen have been injuries to uke, but I went through about a year where I kept getting hurt as nage. It was usually something like twisting my back the wrong way, but as a result I can easily imagine a situation in which injuries were 50/50 nage/uke. I wonder if it's because ukes tend to be too passive, just going along for the ride.

By the way, I also enjoy learning ukemi, and think it's the most practical part of aikido, in terms of what it will do for your safety in daily life. I mean, how often are you going to face a knife-weilding attacker, versus how often you're going to take a spill on a patch of ice or trip over something?

ruthmc
03-13-2006, 08:17 AM
Ruth, I couldnt agree more with you. Excellent post.
Cheers Nick!

Reckon I should continue arguing with all those instructors then :D

Ruth

MaryKaye
03-13-2006, 01:45 PM
I pulled a muscle once doing stretches at home, but have never been badly hurt on the mat in three years of training. My Head Instructor is *very* safety-conscious, and though she frustrates me sometimes (I want to learn more breakfalls!) I do appreciate the results.

I did take one ukemi onto my head and shoulder that I'm surprised didn't break my collarbone. But apparently despite my age I have pretty solid bones--here's hoping they stay that way. SInce then I have worked hard on the skill of tucking into a tight ball and rolling when dropped straight downwards, and have managed to avoid landing that way a second time.

Mary Kaye

Dajo251
03-13-2006, 02:17 PM
Isn't it interesting how the majority of injuries seem to occur in the person taking ukemi?

My theory is that ukemi skills are not sufficiently encouraged in many dojo, leading to a mindset that "throwing people is the fun part" and "ukemi is a necessary evil". As a result, people work a lot on perfecting their techniques and very little on improving their ukemi.

I have had numerous disagreements with instructors about why this is allowed to happen. They say that they have to encourage beginners to come back, so they prefer to teach them techniques as they believe that beginners will not be so motivated by learning ukemi...

Personally I think that learning to fly is fun! When I started Aikido classes I was always very impressed by those students who could take good ukemi. Never thought I'd ever be able to do it myself though :) Those who were good at applying technique did not impress me so much, as I thought that would be easier to learn :D

More than 14 years later, I haven't changed my opinions a lot, although I now know that both ukemi and nagemi are difficult to learn well!

Ruth (numerous injures all caused by poor ukemi skills on my part)
During class I often have more fun getting thrown then doing the throwing

Lyle Bogin
03-13-2006, 02:50 PM
My worst aikido injury was a re-broken rib.

Karen Wolek
03-13-2006, 03:24 PM
During class I often have more fun getting thrown then doing the throwing

Me too!!!!

I don't have the best ukemi in the world, but I am still working on it. Most of my (minor) injuries have been as uke, but the busted nose, I was nage. Ikkyo ura, elbow in the nose. Ouch! Ma'ai is VERY important, people! :uch:

Ron Tisdale
03-13-2006, 03:32 PM
Ok, gotta ask...how did you originally break it?

Best,
Ron

Michael O'Brien
03-13-2006, 05:33 PM
Isn't it interesting how the majority of injuries seem to occur in the person taking ukemi?

My theory is that ukemi skills are not sufficiently encouraged in many dojo, leading to a mindset that "throwing people is the fun part" and "ukemi is a necessary evil". As a result, people work a lot on perfecting their techniques and very little on improving their ukemi.

I have had numerous disagreements with instructors about why this is allowed to happen. They say that they have to encourage beginners to come back, so they prefer to teach them techniques as they believe that beginners will not be so motivated by learning ukemi...

Personally I think that learning to fly is fun! When I started Aikido classes I was always very impressed by those students who could take good ukemi. Never thought I'd ever be able to do it myself though :) Those who were good at applying technique did not impress me so much, as I thought that would be easier to learn :D

More than 14 years later, I haven't changed my opinions a lot, although I now know that both ukemi and nagemi are difficult to learn well!

Ruth (numerous injures all caused by poor ukemi skills on my part)
Our dojo has actually started a class one day a week that is dedicated entirely to learning how to take better ukemi and become a better uke.

Right now I work on that night and am unable to attend and I hate it. :(

Murgen
03-13-2006, 07:12 PM
I've never been hurt in Aikido more than a mat burns, minor knee/ankle sprains, bruises and chronic wrist pain due to the locks. I find Aikdio to be pretty safe even when we are going at it. Some Chronic neck pain due to computer work but aggravated by Ukemi. If a sensei hurt a student out of ego or lack of control they shouldn't be a sensei in my book and I would find another dojo.

Muay Thai: Severly sprained and possibly broken foot when I caught an elbow on the top on my ankle (bad technique probably), black eyes and some nice big black bruises. Interesting thing is I never felt the foot it until we stopped sparring and I almost immediately couldn't walk on it.

Dajo251
03-13-2006, 09:35 PM
Me too!!!!

I don't have the best ukemi in the world, but I am still working on it. Most of my (minor) injuries have been as uke, but the busted nose, I was nage. Ikkyo ura, elbow in the nose. Ouch! Ma'ai is VERY important, people! :uch:


ick, I accedently punched my sensei in the nose doing an atemi last week....he said do the atemi with feeling, uke should get out of the way....this was about 10 seconds before I hit him, thankfully no broken nose, no blood but it was a good laugh

Nick Simpson
03-14-2006, 07:03 AM
Reckon I should continue arguing with all those instructors then

Hehe, well I wouldnt 'argue' perse, but I have pressed the issue once and It was just sort of bypassed and considered by this individual to be not too important, so I havent bothered since. Whenever I teach I generally do a half and half mix of ukemi/technique for the focus of the class. Im also trying to introduce some of Waite Sensei's softer ukemi too.

Alot of people also attack incorrectly (flaws, openings, lack of committment etc etc) and this is something I believe should really be focused upon...

ruthmc
03-14-2006, 08:13 AM
Hehe, well I wouldnt 'argue' perse, but I have pressed the issue once and It was just sort of bypassed and considered by this individual to be not too important, so I havent bothered since.
That's been my experience too so far :(

Whenever I teach I generally do a half and half mix of ukemi/technique for the focus of the class. Im also trying to introduce some of Waite Sensei's softer ukemi too.
Sounds good - your students are lucky!

Alot of people also attack incorrectly (flaws, openings, lack of committment etc etc) and this is something I believe should really be focused upon...
Absolutely agreed - everything from the limp lettuce leaf attack to just being plain off-course make it incredibly difficult to study Aikido effectively. As tori you either have to change the technique completely or modify it so much to prevent uke from injuring himself that it just doesn't work anymore. If only more uke realised just how dangerous they make things for themselves with poor attacks..

Or we could just let them find out the hard way :D evileyes :D

Ruth

Nick Simpson
03-14-2006, 08:35 AM
Sounds good - your students are lucky!

Thanks, But Im just the dogsbody assistant instructor ;)

Absolutely agreed - everything from the limp lettuce leaf attack to just being plain off-course make it incredibly difficult to study Aikido effectively. As tori you either have to change the technique completely or modify it so much to prevent uke from injuring himself that it just doesn't work anymore. If only more uke realised just how dangerous they make things for themselves with poor attacks..

Again, Im totally down with this. What can you do though? Everytime I want to do an indepth striking class, theres no novices present :p

Lyle Bogin
03-15-2006, 02:47 PM
Ron - I originally broke my rib practicing kung fu...a type of "one inch palm strike" my friend and I were trying on each other. Pure stupidity I'd say. Then I broke it again free sparring full contact, which is more of a moderate level of stupidy. Then the third time was during an over zealous "tai-atari" irimi attack that was more like a yokomen uchi. That time it may have been my training partners stupidity on top of my own. Now I cover my ribs with a forearm during tai atari practice...a bit non-traditional for SBK ukemi but the days of taking chances are over in aspects such as this.

Ah, they joys of practice.

-L