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Dominic Toupin
05-20-2005, 03:17 PM
Hi,

I just found a pretty good video that show a lot about Yoseikan World Federation.

http://www.yoseikancanada.ca/v_yo_qt.html

The video contains pretty good sutemi technique, randori, jiu-jitsu technique, competition and demonstration. You also see a nice kote-gaeshi, a brutal mukae daoshi, some ashi tori technique like Ashi Tori Neji Taoshi and some weapons demonstration...

I think that that video shows how Yoseikan is today.

Any comments ?

Devin McDowell
05-20-2005, 04:06 PM
Lots of striking. I wish the dojo I train at had full contact like that.

kironin
05-20-2005, 05:13 PM
Some nice acrobatics set to a rocking beat.
Some almost looks like Capoeira moves.
Looks like fun for teenagers.

not a big fan of foam sword fighting myself.

Looks more like what the American karate studios in town are doing than anything related to Aikido.

xuzen
05-20-2005, 09:06 PM
Never seen MMA type Cage fight myself... not available in my country. But somehow, from experience I have from this forum, the perception I have formed ... are MMA type matches also like this?

Boon.

David Yap
05-21-2005, 04:27 AM
Never seen MMA type Cage fight myself... not available in my country. But somehow, from experience I have from this forum, the perception I have formed ... are MMA type matches also like this?

Boon.

Definitely not, Boon.

The demo shows the various MA disciplines practised in Yoseikan. AFAIK they don't really do MMA (or "Rojak" MA - fyi for the non-Southeast Asian folk, rojak is a Malaysian fruit salad). Each disciplines (aikido, karate & kenjutsu) are taught separately. They may have gone back to tradition karate though as seen in the demo. Prior to PE karate (1900s) and later sports karate (1950s), karate was a complete system by itself.

Regards

David

mj
05-21-2005, 04:29 AM
The MMA stuff can have a lot of groundwork.

I enjoyed this Yoseikan video. Freedom of movement, variety of techniques and distances, good hard throws.

I think having to wear gloves in the sparring will limit the availability of a lot of normal aikido waza.

kironin
05-21-2005, 07:52 PM
They may have gone back to tradition karate though as seen in the demo. Prior to PE karate (1900s) and later sports karate (1950s), karate was a complete system by itself.



It seems more likely that they just grafted judo/jujutsu moves into their curriculum. It's rare to find someone that really understands anything really deep about traditional Okinawan karate is my impression. Kenji Ushiro Sensei might be one of them
http://www.aikidojournal.com/expo/?instructor=4

His classes at Aiki Expo have been interesting.

Takuan
05-21-2005, 09:44 PM
With all due respect not my cupa tea at all. Too much grapling and punching. I also don't understand why anyone would want to make anything related to Aikido competitive, wasn't O Sensei clear enough on that matter?

eyrie
05-22-2005, 03:30 AM
Looks like (really good) hapkido to me....

Dominic Toupin
05-22-2005, 10:07 PM
Looks more like what the American karate studios in town are doing than anything related to Aikido.

If you look in the video, just after the first shot of bokken vs bokken, you see a very nice kote gaeshi. They're a lot of sutemi waza and that very nice mukae daoshi almost like that technique that Steven Seagal did in the beginning of Nico (Irimi Nage ?) Sorry I'm not familiar with the Aikikai name of the technique

Never seen MMA type Cage fight myself... not available in my country... are MMA type matches also like this?

This type of randori shiai with gloves and foam helmet are like MMA but with rules and protective gears


I think having to wear gloves in the sparring will limit the availability of a lot of normal aikido waza.

There is a lot of sutemi technique that you can do with the gloves, a lot of judo throws, some technique with leg grabbing also...

With all due respect not my cup tea at all. Too much grappling and punching. I also don't understand why anyone would want to make anything related to Aikido competitive, wasn't O Sensei clear enough on that matter?

With all due respect, competition is seen in Yoseikan more like a challenge for the competitor. It's done with respect and humility. It's a very effective goal for the young practitioner. In Yoseikan there is always a place for the martial way and also the competitive way. We train in both...

Dominic Toupin
05-29-2005, 07:32 AM
Any comments from Yoseikan folks here ? Is this video gives a good overview of Yoseikan ?

phil farmer
07-01-2005, 01:29 PM
I will comment as a fellow Yoseikan practitioner. First of all, competition in Yoseikan Budo represents only about 15% of the art. It satisfies a need of many younger martial artists in that it gives them a chance to learn and practice powerful technique in a fun way.

There is no Yoseikan Karate or JiuJitsu or Aiki any more, within the World Federation. Now it is just Yoseikan Budo and within that are throws, atemi, joint locks, pins, ground work, etc. In former years these areas were separated out but Master Hiroo Mochizuki wants it to be one system. He has plenty of authority and background to develop Yoseikan atemi since he has high rank in Shotokan and Wado Ryu karate styles and is one of the founders and long time technical advisor to the French and European Karate Federations.

Yoseikan has always been included as a variation of aikido, since the founder Minoru Mochizuki was on of the Pre-WW II masters Prannin wrote about in his book. The truth probably is that it should have been called a soft jiujitsu style all of these years. The traditional Yoseikan skills are much closer to aikijutsu or even daito ryu than you see these days in aiki styles. I would inform all concerned however, that Hiroo Mochizuki was a direct student of Ueshiba Sensei in the mid 1950's and has rank and is an excellent aikido practitioner in his own write. The promotional video is an excellent example of all of the skills used in the Yoseikan Budo style. I will add that the musical portions: Yoseikan Training and Yoseikan Sparring are later creations of Mitchi Mochizuki (son) and Jean Max Brignon and are designed for cardio vascular training and timing and rhythm training respectively. The Sparring is set to music and students are learning sparring skills at double the rate of students learning without the music.

As to the padded weapons, well it's a bit dangerous to use bokken or katana in a competition. Seriously, though, the primary use of the padded weapons is to give even beginning students the chance to learn how to use weapons in a realistic manner sooner. There are also kenjutsu and iai jutsu skills in the style. Are they any good? Well, after 10 years of Yoseikan and training with bokken and doing our katas I had the opportunity to actually do tameshi geri (sp.) and was successful to the point that I was asked where I learned to make the cuts. My reply, Yoseikan.

I am glad to see the video posted. Folks, try to reserve judgement until you see the skills first hand. We have a great safety record and practitioners in 29 countries, it must be worth something.

Dr. Phil Farmer
U.S. Y. B.A/YWF

bryce_montgomery
07-01-2005, 03:24 PM
Yes it is a good video. It works to a nice beat and offers really nice upbeat footage.

As for cups-a-tea, I believe that it showed a good bit of what Yoseikan must mean and I was very impressed with all of it. It drew me in and made me say the famous Keanu Reeves line, "Whoa..." and as for any other bit with the video, I still enjoyed it and I'd like to see all that stuff in action.

(with reserved judgement) Bryce ;)

neb1979
07-02-2005, 01:30 AM
The traditional Yoseikan skills are much closer to aikijutsu or even daito ryu than you see these days in aiki styles. I would inform all concerned however, that Hiroo Mochizuki was a direct student of Ueshiba Sensei in the mid 1950's and has rank and is an excellent aikido practitioner in his own write

Hey Phil,

I agree with you that the traditional Yoseikan skills are much more of a so called harder "style" than that of the Aiki. I wanted to query something though, is Hiroo Mochizuki the son of Minoru Mochizuki? I thought he was but in your reply you said that Hiroo was a direct student of O'Sensei. I didn't realize that Hiroo trained directly from O'Sensei. I thought his father Minoru had trained him in the art of Aikido? :)

Thanks in advance :)

Ben

neb1979
07-02-2005, 01:31 AM
Sorry just to be clear I train in Yoseikan

Cheers Ben

Robert Cheshire
07-03-2005, 10:39 PM
Hey Phil,
I wanted to query something though, is Hiroo Mochizuki the son of Minoru Mochizuki? I thought he was but in your reply you said that Hiroo was a direct student of O'Sensei. I didn't realize that Hiroo trained directly from O'Sensei. I thought his father Minoru had trained him in the art of Aikido? :)


Phil is actually at the YWF World Stage this week, so, I will answer this question. Hiroo is the oldest son of Minoru. Master Minoru sent Hiroo to O Sensei to train under him just like Minoru did. Hiroo had open (public) and private classes with O Sensei.

:ai: :ki:

darin
08-07-2005, 04:32 AM
Nice post Domonic. Mitchi Mochizuki showed me a similar video when he visited Australia.

I think YWF may scare off a lot of traditionalists. In my dojo only one person joined the YWF with me as the rest of my students only want to learn aikido.

Foam sword fighting isn't really sword fighting but neither is kendo...