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aikidoc
01-07-2005, 05:54 PM
Has anyone every heard of Tamio Kamura? This was apparently a sensei teaching aikido in the Florida area in the early or mid 1970s. It comes from a website where the sensei claimed to study with him. Any of you long time Florida aikidoka every heard of him. I think it was in the Ft. Lauderdale area.


Here is the website he was referenced on: http://www.goldendragondojo.homestead.com/renshibio.html

spinecracker
01-07-2005, 06:05 PM
I did a quick websearch, but all I could find was that a Tamio Kamura was (and may still be) active in Kendo and wrote a Kendo text titled "Kendo jiten: Gijutsu to bunka no rekishi". anyone else with more info? :D

aikidoc
01-07-2005, 07:19 PM
This guys website touts him as an aikido master?

spinecracker
01-07-2005, 09:29 PM
Without intending any disrespect, I examined the certifications shown on the gentleman's wesite and have had some difficulty in finding information on the organizations awarding the grades. Some of the certifications are from "soke councils' and other such organizations that recognise a person's level of training based on the certificates (and probably the fee!) that is sent to them. The instructor is listed on the World Combat Martial Artists Association website as 10th Deg. Black Belt Fusho Satori Ryu (the style he created), 1st Degree Black Belt IKKA Kenpo, 1st Degree Black Belt Aikido, but does not list some of his other higher level certifications, such as a 6th Dan in a form of karate and a menkyo in another form. Anyone else with info???? :D

Don_Modesto
01-07-2005, 10:20 PM
Has anyone every heard of Tamio Kamura? http://www.goldendragondojo.homestead.com/renshibio.html

Nope, never heard of him. The only aikido I know of around at that time was Steve House under Yamada. As an avid teen several years into my training at that time, I perused the new phone books and toured the local dojos with my very patient father. Kamura I would have remembered. Maybe you had to know the secret handshake to gain introduction.

From the URL, above: "In 1974 Soke was in Ft. Lauderdale, Fl. and trained under Master instructor Tamio Kamura at the "Way of Life" Dojo. This Dojo Trained in Aikido. A new way to not hurt. Soke was impressed by the use of the others movements to defend instead of hard contact defense. Soke Trained here until 1975 when he was awarded his 1st degree black in this style."

'"Way of Life" Dojo'--was it connected with eyeliner? (cf: Kanebo--For Beautiful Human Life!)

One year to Shodan. Zowee.


http://www.goldendragondojo.homestead.com/renshiphotos.html

Maybe some sword guys would want to comment on the sword posture...

aikidoc
01-07-2005, 10:42 PM
If you look at the certificate from the Way of Life dojo there is no mention of what the black belt is in-I could not find aikido mentioned anywhere. Nor did I recognize any aikido kanji. Of course, I don't know much kanji so maybe as suggested it was written in secret code on the sides.:)

xuzen
01-07-2005, 11:31 PM
Sniff sniff. I smell a rat.

Boon.

Janet Rosen
01-07-2005, 11:56 PM
I think folks are getting "soked"....

aikidoc
01-08-2005, 12:01 AM
I think folks are getting "soked"....

Now that's funny. :p

thomas_dixon
01-08-2005, 12:04 AM
Sniff sniff. I smell a rat.

Boon.

No, thats just bullsh*t.

This guy is probably a fake.

xuzen
01-08-2005, 12:33 AM
Thomas,

I too am thinking along the same line as you after going through his website. He doesn't look very soke'ish to me.

Boon.

David Humm
01-08-2005, 06:22 AM
http://www.goldendragondojo.homestead.com/renshiphotos.html

Maybe some sword guys would want to comment on the sword posture...

Posture ? Nope no sword posture there. Plus the 'weapon' he's holding looks very much like a cheep Spanish reproduction "fantasy" sword. Nothing a serious sword user or indeed any martial artist would touch with a barge-pole.

Its nothing more that a wall hanger and a tacky bit of shite at that.

I'm somewhat amazed by the picture slightly further down the page on the left, a stars & stripes Gi !!

Everything on this and the other page says to me "stay well away"

Indeed the quote on the top of the page is ironic...

"Don't Judge An Instructor By The Papers On The Wall, But On The Love Of The Art In His Heart"
"Quote By Soke Bruce D. Calkins"

But, I do admit to being envious of the certificate from Quest Ninja... I've always wanted to be a Ninja and flip out all the time.

Jerry Miller
01-08-2005, 10:28 AM
Walker Sensei taught out of the YMCA in Titusville in the late sixties and early seventies before he established his dojo. George Wilson was teaching out of Patrick Air force base around then. Another fellow ran an Aikido club in Sarasota (he was not Dan ranked yet). I never heard of anyone else back then, but it could be I guess.

thomas_dixon
01-08-2005, 10:59 AM
Walker Sensei taught out of the YMCA in Titusville in the late sixties and early seventies before he established his dojo. George Wilson was teaching out of Patrick Air force base around then. Another fellow ran an Aikido club in Sarasota (he was not Dan ranked yet). I never heard of anyone else back then, but it could be I guess.

Now you have Sand Drift Aikkai which seems to be out of business, the Enmei Dojo and that's about it. The Martial art offered at the YMCA now is Karate.

Thomas,

I too am thinking along the same line as you after going through his website. He doesn't look very soke'ish to me.

Boon.

I agree. I'd steer away from him and find a respectable dojo to train at, where people don't claim to be Soke.

aikidoc
01-08-2005, 04:29 PM
If anyone can read the kanji on the Way of Life dojo certificate, I'd be interested in what it says.

aikidoc
01-08-2005, 09:15 PM
Now you have Sand Drift Aikkai which seems to be out of business.


I don't know if Sand Drift is out of business but I believe Tom Walker died so I imagine the website was his.

thomas_dixon
01-08-2005, 09:50 PM
I don't know if Sand Drift is out of business but I believe Tom Walker died so I imagine the website was his.

I've called the place 3 times within the last year and left messages to be returned to inquire about classes. Never recieved a reply.

aikidoc
01-09-2005, 08:57 AM
A friend PM'd and told me his Japanes wife looked at some of the certificates and just said "Oh my God". Apparently, the Aikido certificate says something about kempo on the right side. Now that could be an honest mistake, I was with a group that split from a Ki Society splinter group. When they were trying to make up their dan certificates their lack of knowledge of the Japanese language and borrowing some of the Kanji from another art caused them to do a similar thing. Fortunately, we had a Japanese girl visiting us and pointed out the problems so we could fix them. However, if you claim you got the certificate from a Japanese master that would seem to be concerning. :rolleyes:

However, if you are trying to translate from English to Japanese you might want to hire someone to do it for you. With what little I know of the language it is not easy to learn and the sentence structure and use of the kanji can be touchy. Kanji apparently can have several meaning as can different words depending on the context.

PRapoza
01-09-2005, 09:21 AM
John,

You sure are spending a lot of time on this guy. Are you worried all your students are gonna move to FL to study with him.
I'm sure there are a thousand guys just like him all over the place, so what. What else is new?
__________
Paul

aikidoc
01-09-2005, 09:28 AM
Not really. Just happened to run across him. Yep, there are a lot like him. However, I do find it interesting to observe the lengths people go to in attempts at making themselves look credible.

Actually, I was more interested in the "master" he studied under since I had never heard of him.

David Humm
01-09-2005, 12:31 PM
Perhaps someone (lol) should email this chap and let him know of this thread and let him defend his credibility.

Might make for interesting reading.

kironin
01-09-2005, 02:53 PM
Might make for interesting reading.


Not really, this just strikes me as a blue-collar guy in small town rural western New York (50 miles east of Buffalo) running a tiny program that couldn't possibly support him. He is very much a part of that very common American martial arts culture that is a fan of a strange mish-mash of things asian mixed with american kickboxing/kenpo mixed with scifi fantasy movies (Star Trek, Lord of the Rings, etc.). He is probably a fan of Orange County Choppers too by the look of his tricked up trike.

He is just the visible tip of the iceberg. One of those guys who knows just enough html or has a kid who knows just enough to create a look of one of those horrid looking amateur websites from the mid-90's.
:rolleyes:

It really is a waste of time to beat up on one of these guys. His credibility will remain in the small town where he is and within the martial art he made up.

Has almost zero to do with aikido. Serious kenpo or kung fu students have far more reason to go break his rice bowl.

aikidoc
01-09-2005, 03:39 PM
Absolutely. At least he's not claiming to teach aikido and claiming 10th degree, grandmaster soke of Aikido.

Lan Powers
01-09-2005, 06:55 PM
John,

You sure are spending a lot of time on this guy. Are you worried all your students are gonna move to FL to study with him.
I'm sure there are a thousand guys just like him all over the place, so what. What else is new?
__________
Paul

Let's not forget pure old fashioned entertainment value. :p

As one of Riggs Sensei's students, I can say that I probably won't move to FL.......quite happy here, Thank you. :p
Lan

kironin
01-10-2005, 04:10 AM
Absolutely. At least he's not claiming to teach aikido and claiming 10th degree, grandmaster soke of Aikido.

You mean like these

http://ishh.net/soke%20burdine.htm
http://www.uscra.info/photo_gallery.htm
http://www.aikido-dynamic.co.uk/sensei.htm
http://www.aikido-chch.co.nz/reviews/streetdefense.html
http://www.ndcma.com/SokeJorgeLuisGarcia-Ortiz.html

aikidoc
01-10-2005, 07:08 AM
Wow. A couple I had not ran across. One guy started martial arts training in 1985 and is already a soke of Aikido. Or should that be "soaky".

Don_Modesto
01-10-2005, 11:55 AM
FWIW, below is a classic article on the origins of "SOKE." If our SOKE friends had read it, they might not be so enthusiastic to smear themselves with the title. The author is PhD in Japanese History and a long-time KORYU practitioner William Bodiford. His posts are excellent and concise. It's worthwhile doing a search on his name at www.e-budo.com as he's posted some very insightful stuff. (Karl Friday's posts are interesting, too. They also post on Iaido-L.)

Soke: Historical Incarnations of a Title and its Entitlements
http://www.koryu.com/library/wbodiford1.html

SmilingNage
01-10-2005, 12:24 PM
I hope you all "soke'd" up that article posted by Don.
It pretty much puts that "soke'd" topic out to dry

jonreading
01-10-2005, 12:40 PM
John,

Checked through the credentials and couldn't find anything confirming; many of the awards seem to be unrelated to organizations I consider respectable. Seems kinda funny.

Also, if you check out the rest of his site, lots of things don't seem to match up to a dojo environment (you should see the dojo tricycle). I'd have serious doubts at first blush with any of his titles, let alone his instructors.

All:
There was a great thread about dojo frauds that seems to relate. Read some of those comments, then check this thread again. I think you'll find some similarities in the threads...

akiy
01-10-2005, 05:08 PM
Posts regarding the Klingon martial art have been relocated here:

http://www.aikiweb.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7288

-- Jun

giriasis
01-10-2005, 10:41 PM
Regarding Sand Drift Aikikai:

When I last visited them in June at their Melbourne dojo, the members told me that you won't be able to reach them inTitusville any more because they lost their dojo location a year ago, and they were looking for another location. And they were also worried about losing their location on Melbourne Beach. I believe their Vero dojo is still open. Grady Lane (USAF) also teaches in Melbourne at the YMCA in the Suntree/ Viera area. He has some solid and very well-centered aikido, and he was a student of Don Walker's

Florida Aikikai in Ft. Lauderdale has been around for almost 25 years now. Peter Bernath has been the mainstay there during that time period.

aikidoc
01-11-2005, 09:20 AM
You might check the Sand Drift people out with Aikido Association of America. At one time, they were members. I don't know their current status.

Tim Gerrard
01-15-2005, 08:35 AM
It always strikes me as funny that there are more masters and sokes in the US than in Japan, that stars and stripes gi is awesome! I'm still wiping the tears from my eyes!

Golden Dragon...sounds like my local chinese takeaway...
hmm...I could go for some chinese...

thomas_dixon
01-15-2005, 10:01 AM
It always strikes me as funny that there are more masters and sokes in the US than in Japan, that stars and stripes gi is awesome! I'm still wiping the tears from my eyes!

Golden Dragon...sounds like my local chinese takeaway...
hmm...I could go for some chinese...

That could be because japan has better morals than us...but then again we're not selling used school girl panties out of vending machines.