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Peter
03-07-2001, 10:13 AM
Hello,
I just have a question to you aikidoka. I started doing hapkido this year, which has some similar aspects to aikido. Anyway, recently we attempted sparring using only our self-defense techniques. These techniques are similar to the ones used in aikido (although we probably don't go as in depth into them as you guys do). We had real trouble executing these techniques on each other as we expected what was coming and didn't let our partner execute the particular technique.

My question is: How do you practice these techniques? I know you guys do "randori" which I gather is a form of free sparring. Do both people try to do the techniques or does one try to attack with strikes, etc. Basically it degenerated into a poor excuse for judo (nothing against judo).

Peter

andrew
03-07-2001, 10:25 AM
Peter wrote:
We had real trouble executing these techniques on each other as we expected what was coming and didn't let our partner execute the particular technique.

My question is: How do you practice these techniques? I know you guys do "randori" which I gather is a form of free sparring. Do both people try to do the techniques or does one try to attack with strikes, etc. Basically it degenerated into a poor excuse for judo (nothing against judo).

Peter
First off, read this piece on Aikido training:

http://gargas.biomedicale.univ-paris5.fr/eurocal/ecrits/ukemi1.html

Aikido doesn't work, training wise at least, without a certain amount of co-operation between partners. If you're attacked in a hesitant or non-committed manner you're not going to get any real flow going, unless you know how do draw attacks. Gotta walk very slowly before you run, I'm afraid.
The article should give a much better idea of how we learn our techniques... It specifically addresses the practice of blocking what you know is coming. (Yes, we have that too. It's ignorant, irritating and counter-productive in most situations.)
andrew

Sam
03-09-2001, 07:41 AM
It takes a lot of time and patience to learn to apply a perfect technique of a resisting person who knows that technique. At first this can be very frustrating, but in time is perfectly possible.
It cannot be compared to sparring in a striking art directly because the aim of a single strike is not the aim of a technique.
An aikido(like) technique finishes the bout completely because usually it ends in a pin or lock of some description.
To end a bout completely with striking, a several strike combination is usually needed (although in sparring to end a bout by stiking would indicate excessive contact!).
It is very difficult to execute a 6 strike combo. It is very difficult to execute a throw and lock technique, but both have value so are worth attempting despite the difficulty.

ian
03-09-2001, 09:16 AM
If you want realistic sparring practise with aikido; go up behind your partner when they are outside the dojo and strike them hard with yokomen uchi, from behind. If they are still standing/alive, as they turn round, hit them as hard as you can in the face with your fist. A realistic sparring excercise will then ensue(although this is often even more realistic when done with a complete stanger).

Ian

ian
03-09-2001, 09:24 AM
P.S. that message was only done in jest.

Trying to do 'real' sparring with aikido techniques is very dangerous. As mentioned above, the closest you can get is have one attacker and one defender. This becomes most liberal when any attack and any defence is allowed. However don't ever believe this is realistic. Don't forget Ueshiba said that Aikido is 80/90% atemis (many other percentages have also been mentioned!).

If you were going to go one on one realistically, you would have to allow strikes (to distract them from the technique) - this would include very serious damaging strikes if you are going up against someone who has a good idea of what you can do - therefore you would never get into a 'judo' situation. In addition, I'm a big believer in using appropriate force - if you are caught in a deadlock you cannot miss any opportunity to disable your opponent, so a wrist/arm break at least would be necessary. Also, you should have a good idea of the appropriate counter techniques.

What you suggest is a completely artifical situation. If you want to avoid deaths and serious injury, train with 'focus' i.e. what potential your technique has, when you would use it etc, and with formalised but realistic attacks. The only realistic fighting experience are real fights; and the strange thing about those is they are almost always different (in my experience).

Ian