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when doing this techniques ...how is my arm suppose to hit the person face ?
the most effective way ?
in my dojo they teach to go for the side chin .
12-05-2002, 10:03 AM
If you go with your arm straight and diagonal at uke's face, a strong uke can resist the technique. We are tought to put our bent arm from the chin and straight up towards ukes eyebrows (ie vertical), and then use the "follow your own thumb" motion.
Do you understand how I mean? It's pretty hard to explain with words. Especially english ones... :)
The way I do it (which works for me and of course there are other ways of doing this):
Uke attacks me with shomen uchi. I enter on the outside (irimi) until I'm nearly behind uke. then I hold either his gi collar from behind or the side of his neck and pull him toward my shoulder. This will offbalance uke.
About the same time I pull uke toward me, I raise and arch my other arm in preparation for the finish. One or more tenkan later, I just stop my tai sabaki and uke continues passed me, falling to the floor.
I don't really notice where my "cutting" arm goes and what part of it hits uke. Accodring to my numerous uke, my arm doesn't strike them. I just position the arm and set uke up.
12-05-2002, 11:02 AM
The most important part of the technique is entering and getting behind uke. From there it can go many ways, just remember, lead uke close to you and try not to clothesline him/her!
12-05-2002, 11:23 AM
Bud, that's exactly the way we do it in my dojo aswell. I sometimes pull a bit in the collar (eri?) of my uke, just to be on the safe side. :)
12-05-2002, 03:11 PM
In my Dojo at the the later stage of the technique we emphesize the arm coming up under the uke's chin, then moving the arm straight up and forward. This forces the uke's chin up and his head goes back. The head going back with the arm under the chin forces the uke to arch his back unbalalncing him completely. Then as the technique continues the uke falls straight back.
12-05-2002, 06:43 PM
I am a beginner and Sensei demonstrated an Irimi Nage technique on one of our green belts. It looked very violent and jarring to the Uke. I wanted to see the technique again, and asked Sensei if I could see how it worked. He asked me to come up and try to hit him in the stomach (mune tsuke?)
Anyway, I came at him and in seconds I was flattened. It was surprisingly fluid, and didn't hurt like I had thought it would. It was like he didn't even touch me.
In Irimi, I have seen the Nage guide the Uke around by the back of the neck, and by the back of the collar of the Gi. In our Dojo we kind of "wrap" around the Uke's head and pin the head up against the chest with your arm. Do any of you do it that way?
12-07-2002, 05:10 AM
kepp your hips in the proper position. If your hips are not in the proper place, then the position of your arms will not matter one iota. Make sure your hips are stable and just past uke's hips. You arm should come straight out over uke's opposing shoulder, with the general neck areain the crook of your bent arm. Hope this helps. Pleasant training.
12-21-2002, 03:24 AM
ivan you dont say how long you have been training in aikido so i will assume you are quite new to it irimi nage is also known as the 20 year technique so it takes a while to get it right the striking arm is a bit fake as a beginner in the orgaization a train with (its at a higher level where the striking arm gets used) contoling the head is of more importance where ever the head goes the body will follow my advice would be concentrate on the getting behind uke and pulling their head into your chest as you finish your taisabaki and take uke's balance you can then either step forward and use your second arm in a cutting action or just turn their head as you step and they usually just fall over the first time i ever recieved this throw on my first night at aikido (a few years ago) i thought my head was going to twist right off so stick with it its a fantastic technique when you can get it right
12-21-2002, 10:03 AM
We (Tenshinkai Aikido) teach the forearm goes up the jaw from chin to ear. Then point the finger to the heels (rear balance point, one shin's length from center, third leg of the stool) while pushing the lower back forward to take the balance. Enter early to intercept and interrupt the momentum while getting off the line of attack.
01-07-2003, 07:10 AM
Irimi nage is an old technique found in many jujutsu systems. I have been told it is an 'oh crap' battle field technique. When one finds himself on the battle field weaponless and is being attacked by a sword or other weapon in a shomen type attack they could attempt to perform an irimi nage style defense/counter attack.
With regards to the hand I have been taught that the old technique uses a blade hand to the base neck on the opposite side. This would be the opening in the armor between the helmet and the shoulder armor. Although as others have mentioned the hand really isn't the most important part of the technique. The likelyhood of striking between the armor with any amount of force is fairly low, hence the real technique is the placement of the hips and driving those hips through the attacker to knock him down. Once an armored opponent is on the ground it takes awhile to get back up, buying time for tori to seek out another weapon or change geographic location.
Since we don't wear armor this technique has changed and I haven't seen many places that teach the base of the neck strike. One reason is the strike to the base of the neck is kinda nasty to train. Another reason is without armor there are numerous other targets and opportunities to exploit. As someone pointed out their teacher dropped them very lightly using irimi nage, thereby giving this technique more peaceful options. I have seen many different placements/uses of the hand for various purposes and affects. My suggestion to Ivan is to learn the method taught by your sensei and to focus on the hips/feet. Take care.
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