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iplan
07-29-2016, 11:29 AM
A few months ago, I saw the most intriguing youtube video on gun defenses ~ and now I can not find it.

The particular video demonstrated how to use aikido techniques to keep from having your gun taken away from you.

In other words, the good guy had the gun, and the bad guy was trying to disarm him.

The techniques used were simple tenkan movements, nikkyo, ikkyo, iriminage, kokyunage, etc.

I have searched and searched without finding it ~ any assistance would be appreciated!

best,
iplan

iplan
07-29-2016, 11:43 AM
I found it ~~~

www.youtube.com/watch?v=q89PMSAwbE8

rugwithlegs
07-29-2016, 06:32 PM
http://john-hillson.blogspot.com/2015/08/tanto-nage.html

Maybe the one clip on handgun retention here? I assume all our Jo Nage practices had a background in rifle retention. There was a book on police Aikido that had a demo of kubishime attacks with the wrist being held while Nage was removing the pistol from the holster.

jurasketu
07-30-2016, 05:14 PM
James Williams does weapon retention.

http://www.systemofstrategy.com/

mathewjgano
07-31-2016, 02:25 PM
Here's one method, by Bob Koga: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCXGslNmd9E

jurasketu
07-31-2016, 04:53 PM
Sometimes for fun I teach weapon retention exercises since it is a natural extension of wrist grabs. Just give it a try with a tanto or a baton. Be careful - weapon amplified techniques can deliver serious pain.

ninjedi
08-09-2016, 11:14 AM
Lots of stuff on weapon retention can be traced back to samurai using similar techniques to keep others from pulling/drawing/taking their sword or wakizashi. Seems almost more common (and rightly so) to teach weapon retention rather than gun disarms in the dojo.

genego
08-19-2016, 12:13 AM
As a retired police officer with 30 years experience, (and 35 years Aikido practice), I can't help but think that my firearms instructors would have lost it watching someone waving their gun around one handed. Having made an arrest or two over the years, I cannot remember every holding someone at gunpoint while holding the firearm extended at arms length in one hand. That is just begging for a person to attempt a gun grab.

rugwithlegs
08-19-2016, 07:22 AM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bWsz7u4eN8I

Yeah, there is some goofy fun stuff out there. With all of the non-empty hand stuff, important not to let Hollywood set the standard. I imagine the best retention strategies involve prevention - control Maai and keep aware.

dps
09-04-2016, 01:20 PM
As a retired police officer with 30 years experience, (and 35 years Aikido practice), I can't help but think that my firearms instructors would have lost it watching someone waving their gun around one handed. Having made an arrest or two over the years, I cannot remember every holding someone at gunpoint while holding the firearm extended at arms length in one hand. That is just begging for a person to attempt a gun grab.

Instead of "grab my wrist " its grab my gun".

ninjedi
09-08-2016, 01:31 PM
As a retired police officer with 30 years experience, (and 35 years Aikido practice), I can't help but think that my firearms instructors would have lost it watching someone waving their gun around one handed. Having made an arrest or two over the years, I cannot remember every holding someone at gunpoint while holding the firearm extended at arms length in one hand. That is just begging for a person to attempt a gun grab.

Right -- which is why weapons retention is arguably more important to learn as opposed to gun disarms.

rugwithlegs
09-08-2016, 01:49 PM
Right -- which is why weapons retention is arguably more important to learn as opposed to gun disarms.

The blog entry I had above, I was talking about some of the Tomiki practices like Tanto Kaeshiwaza waza and Tanto Nage. I don't do this much, but if a student always obsesses about grabbing rather than cutting I'll pull out stuff for them to hold. Gun retention is useful for a small subset. The forests surrounding our university if you don't keep your cell phone, you cannot phone for help. Lose your keys, long way home and you cannot use your car. I'll hand out small whatever's for students to hold on to, sometimes an object to protect and sometimes an object that could be used as a weapon.

Kisshomaru Doshu had written that Aikido practice included Nage with a knife, uke with a knife, and both uke and Nage with knives. I've never seen it.

Alex Megann
09-09-2016, 06:29 AM
It's interesting to note that everyone contributing to this thread so far is in the USA. I wonder why?

Alex

nikyu62
09-09-2016, 02:12 PM
Because everyone else in the world lost their gun rights to totalitarian governments?

rugwithlegs
09-09-2016, 07:15 PM
It's interesting to note that everyone contributing to this thread so far is in the USA. I wonder why?

Alex

Canadian living in the USA. Point made, but this is a cool practice if you just approach it as not having an empty hand. The second Doshu wrote about Tanto Nage, or Tanto on Tanto as part of Aikido practice. When I worked corrections, I had a radio and keys. I work in hospitals, and I have medications or equipment. Have fun, and make it about more than guns. The practice can apply anywhere if you don't just make it "pull the trigger." In Budo, O Sensei refers to the demonstrated Tanto dori as also techniques against pistols, and jo Dori as against rifles - so maybe on Japanese source on the subject?

Alex Megann
09-10-2016, 11:00 AM
I agree that dealing with someone attempting to take something valuable from your hands is useful and revealing - as you say, think of a wallet or a camera instead. I can't say I have ever worked on this in an aikido class, apart from some jo-dori and batto-ho, so this discussion is interesting, despite the "gun thing".

Alex

ninjedi
09-12-2016, 10:48 AM
Kisshomaru Doshu had written that Aikido practice included Nage with a knife, uke with a knife, and both uke and Nage with knives. I've never seen it.

Yoshokai style has plenty of this.

rugwithlegs
09-13-2016, 07:36 AM
Yoshokai style has plenty of this.

Thanks Josh.

Any clips you recommend of Yoshokai knife retention? Retention of other objects would presumably translate.

ninjedi
09-13-2016, 11:12 AM
Sorry, I meant Yoshokai has several tanto vs tanto techniques, not specifically having to do with retention. The weapons retention stuff I know was gleaned form my Bujinkan days (Takagi Yoshin, if I recall correctly). We started by learning sword retention, then knife, then concluded with how all that can still be applied to modern-day handgun retention.