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tim evans
08-28-2010, 11:03 AM
To many nikkyo,sankyo variations now have me tweaked I,m popping advil like crazy any tips thanks:)

Janet Rosen
08-28-2010, 02:09 PM
To many nikkyo,sankyo variations now have me tweaked I,m popping advil like crazy any tips thanks:)

Tendinitis is one of those things that if not allowed to heal will turn into a nasty chronic injury.
Question to ask yourself is why as uke you are not moving and tapping early enough to not get cranked on- if you cannot solve this you may heal but you sure as heck will just reinjure.
Second thing: there is no shortcut; soft tissue injuries take weeks to heal and if you reinjure during healing process you essentially reset to the onset of the original injury in terms of healing time.
Third thing: taking antiinflammatory for a day or two may help but long term the studies are mixed and there is some evidence they may hinder healing. Using them to mask pain and keep training is, to my mind, madness, and I hope you are not doing that.

Rest, ice plus your healing methods of choice - various folks swear by compression, moxa, acupuncture, topical or internal herbal preparations.

Marc Abrams
08-28-2010, 04:27 PM
Tom Bisio sells a product on Kamwo (they have a website). It is a tendon liniment that works remarkably well. I brew my own (his formulation and he got the chinese dry "stuff" for me, and sell it less than Kamwo (same price that he sells it to his patients). Stuff works remarkably well at speeding the healing process.

Marc Abrams

lbb
08-30-2010, 08:08 AM
Like Marc, I'm also a fan of herbal remedies (and Bisio knows his stuff), but I think that while the words "speed the healing process" are literally true, they can also be misleading. Nothing will "speed the healing process" if, at the same time, you are doing things that slow the healing process and/or aggravate the injury. If you add the right herbal remedy to everything that Janet said, you can get some benefit. If you decide that Janet's advice is just too hard or too tiresome or takes too long, and you're going to try some liniment instead, things will happen exactly as Janet predicted. Fix the cause, treat the symptom, give your body time to heal, learn what to do to prevent recurrences, become sensitive to your body so you know when it needs attention and can treat injury in the early stages rather than letting it become chronic. Tendinitis takes a long time to heal, and it will never heal unless you're diligent about it.

crbateman
08-30-2010, 08:34 AM
Most Chinese herbal stores have several variations of "dit da jow", which is a topical herbal concoction (you probably don't want to know exactly what's in it ;) ). The stuff I get here stinks a bit, but works very well for those aches and pains and strains and...

DarkShodan
08-30-2010, 09:42 AM
I had a lot of problems with my wrists and tendons when I started Aikido. I agree with limiting the stress on your existing injuries. It will not heal if you keep aggravating it. Take it easy. No need to be a tough guy. "Tap Early, Tap Often". Save your body. You're going to be in it a while. I did acupuncture and it worked wonders for my wrists! That's me and I know everyone is different. I also did magnetic wrist wraps. I know everyone here will jump all over me for this, but hey, they worked for me and I know several guys who say it worked for them. Yeah, it's not for everyone but it worked for me. That's all I'm saying.

Good luck! Good health!

ninjaqutie
08-30-2010, 11:00 AM
Like others have said, rest is key. One thing I found that helped me was actually taping my wrists. Gave it some extra support and my partners had a reminder that my wrist was sore by being able to visualize the wrap. I like to use colors other then white for a few reasons.
A) I'm a girl and I like pretty colors :D
B) White kind of blends in, where black, red or blue tends to draw more attention

Make sure you tape it beyond the time your wrist feels better. Just because it feels better doesn't mean it has healed and you don't want to reaggravate it. I taped my wrist about two or three weeks after it started feeling normal again.

Also, like the others said, be proactive and move with your partner and don't wait until it hurts to tap. Tap out BEFORE the pain sets in. Best of luck.

cconstantine
08-30-2010, 11:31 AM
To many nikkyo,sankyo variations now have me tweaked I,m popping advil like crazy any tips thanks:)

Don't overlook possible dislocation of your wrist bones. Those tiny little bones do move around. Consider asking your sensei (depending on his/her experience and knowledge), a general medical doctor, a well-trained massage therapist or a chiropractor to superficially check your wrists.

aikidoc
08-30-2010, 06:37 PM
Rest, ice. Consider laser therapy. Get checked out.

TreyPrice
09-01-2010, 04:01 PM
Red athletic tape! Years ago I took a nasty nikyo and had to favor that side for months. I used red athletic tape to mark that hand. Then my training partner know which one to take it easy on, but for a few months I was a one sided Aikidoka.

my .02

gdandscompserv
09-01-2010, 05:28 PM
I had it in both elbows. Took over a year to completely heal.:eek:

lbb
09-02-2010, 08:00 AM
I had it in both elbows. Took over a year to completely heal.:eek:

I have had tennis elbow in both elbows too -- at the same time (got it from a lot of whitewater kayaking + bad technique + non-ergonomic paddle, not tennis). It was an educational experience, to say the least. Tennis elbow straps helped a lot in preventing further aggravation -- and as I've said before, in the case of tendinitis, I'm a big fan of taping or bracing for daily activities -- I generally find that a sprain or a case of tendinitis does not fully heal for me unless I spend a period of time when I just tape it every day, not just when it hurts or I have some athletic type activity planned.

Janet Rosen
09-02-2010, 10:45 AM
I'm a big fan of taping or bracing for daily activities -- I generally find that a sprain or a case of tendinitis does not fully heal for me unless I spend a period of time when I just tape it every day, not just when it hurts or I have some athletic type activity planned.

Some folks do well w/ the compression/support, others seem to "fight" it. For those who don't like a commercial brace, proper taping can really be a huge help. There are books available (I'm at work now and don't remember the name of the one I have at home) that give very good step by step illustrated instructions for proper taping.

lbb
09-02-2010, 01:25 PM
"Athletic Taping and Bracing", I forget the author but you can find it on Amazon. Broken down by part of the body, it explains common athletic injuries (and some not so common ones), their causes, prevention, treatment and rehab (with a focus on taping and bracing, obvi).

Janet Rosen
09-02-2010, 03:01 PM
Cool!
I use "Martial Arts Injury Care and Prevention" by Trish Bare Grounds, also on Amazon, simply because I happened to find it on sale gently used at a local bookstore yrs ago.
Whatever resource one uses, it really does help to know HOW to tape and not just start sticking it on :-)

ninjaqutie
09-02-2010, 04:03 PM
Whatever resource one uses, it really does help to know HOW to tape and not just start sticking it on :-)

I totally agree. A lot of people don't know how to properly tape an ankle, foot, wrist, etc. I'm not a pro at taping, but over the years, I have picked up some taping knowledge from my personal trainer and my tennis teams sports medicine guru. A lot of people seem to tape the area too lose or too tight or don't use enough tape to give the area proper support.

On another note, I am going to have to look those two books up. Anyone have experience with kinesio tape?

ramenboy
09-02-2010, 08:28 PM
I totally agree. A lot of people don't know how to properly tape an ankle, foot, wrist, etc. I'm not a pro at taping, but over the years, I have picked up some taping knowledge from my personal trainer and my tennis teams sports medicine guru. A lot of people seem to tape the area too lose or too tight or don't use enough tape to give the area proper support.

On another note, I am going to have to look those two books up. Anyone have experience with kinesio tape?

kinesio tape FTW!

i use it for shoulders, knees, back. its great stuff. lets you stay relatively active while an injury recuperates.

like you and janet mentioned... with any kind of taping you have to learn how to do it. kinesio taping is very specific in terms of how much stretch, origin to insertion of muscles, etc.

i never leave for a seminar without a roll

Janet Rosen
09-02-2010, 10:48 PM
Never heard of kinesio tape - guess I better do some research! Thanks, fellow aikiwebbers.

Mark Peckett
09-03-2010, 04:13 AM
With nikkyo I always tell my students to go down first and discuss whether it hurt later; the same applies to sankyo - I leap back about three feet as soon as I feel the technique coming on. It doesn't take long to learn when the technique was beginning to be applied effectively, and when it wasn't and you can provide useful feedback after you've protected yourself.

I realise this doesn't provide a cure for your current tendonitis, but hopefully it might prevent a re-occurence when you're recovered.

thisisnotreal
09-03-2010, 08:14 AM
Have you guys seen the 'pre-cut' kinesio tape? for various applications...see the pic for the upper knee (http://www.k-active.com/k-active_shop/product_info.php?info=p237_K-Active--Tape-PreCut-Upper-Knee-beige.html)..or elbow (http://www.k-active.com/k-active_shop/product_info.php?info=p194_K-Active--Tape-PreCut-Elbow-pink.html), shoulder (http://www.k-active.com/k-active_shop/product_info.php?info=p239_K-Active--Tape-PreCut-Left-Shoulder-blue.html), etc.. ones. Makes it easier..i hear this is good stuff. Probably not super cheap...guess you can copy the templates..make your own.here< (http://www.k-active.com/k-active_shop/index.php?cat=c4_K-Active-Tape-PreCut.html&page=2)fwiw. Good Luck.

lbb
09-03-2010, 10:27 AM
On another note, I am going to have to look those two books up. Anyone have experience with kinesio tape?

I'm told by my boss that you can't just get the stuff and slap it on -- it has to be applied by a professional...um...not sure what. Anyway, his wife is a professional whateveritis, so he's all set. I kinda wish that wasn't true -- there have been times I could really use it (he swears by it).

ramenboy
09-03-2010, 03:54 PM
I'm told by my boss that you can't just get the stuff and slap it on -- it has to be applied by a professional...um...not sure what.

^ which is what i said in my earlier post. :) its very specific in its application.

but it works well. :)

mary, i'd love to have that on my business card: 'certified professional whateveritis'

Walter Martindale
09-04-2010, 11:08 AM
With nikkyo I always tell my students to go down first and discuss whether it hurt later; the same applies to sankyo - I leap back about three feet as soon as I feel the technique coming on. It doesn't take long to learn when the technique was beginning to be applied effectively, and when it wasn't and you can provide useful feedback after you've protected yourself.

I realise this doesn't provide a cure for your current tendonitis, but hopefully it might prevent a re-occurence when you're recovered.

Should probably start a diff't thread, but... I've seen shihan give someone major grief for going with the technique before it's REALLY ON... I guess this may be intended to prevent people not learning to properly apply the technique - if uke goes only when it's properly applied and everything's getting very tight, then it's legit, and nage learns the right lines to apply pressures..

OTOH, people can get hurt if this approach is taken too vigorously..
W

tim evans
09-04-2010, 12:55 PM
^ which is what i said in my earlier post. :) its very specific in its application.

but it works well. :)

mary, i'd love to have that on my business card: 'certified professional whateveritis'

Hey jerome are you coming to the penny bernath seminar nov, 20 weekend at aikido of cincinnati ? btw the pains eased up but I,m taking it real easy:)

ramenboy
09-06-2010, 01:59 PM
Hey jerome are you coming to the penny bernath seminar nov, 20 weekend at aikido of cincinnati ? btw the pains eased up but I,m taking it real easy:)

tim

marking my calendar as we speak. i'll have my kinesio tape handy :P

she, bernath sensei and lizzie lynn sensei are also at aikido of santa barbara which would be great to go to too...

back to the thread subject though, chiba sensei would always say ukemi is absorbing the technique with the whole body. so move your body in a way that the whole body is affected, not just your wrist. don't pull away because it will obviously HURT! get in close to tori for you nikyo ukemi.

regards to charlie sensei, shawn and annunziata

see you guys up there!

tim evans
09-06-2010, 08:44 PM
tim

marking my calendar as we speak. i'll have my kinesio tape handy :P

she, bernath sensei and lizzie lynn sensei are also at aikido of santa barbara which would be great to go to too...

back to the thread subject though, chiba sensei would always say ukemi is absorbing the technique with the whole body. so move your body in a way that the whole body is affected, not just your wrist. don't pull away because it will obviously HURT! get in close to tori for you nikyo ukemi.

regards to charlie sensei, shawn and annunziata

see you guys up there!

Your gonna have to show me that tape:D shawn showed me that nikkyo ukemi that you mentioned it does help .

ninjaqutie
09-07-2010, 11:40 PM
Just like anything else, to use kenesio tape, you just need to educate yourself first. Some sports people are willing to show you/ teach you how to apply it to yourself. My old sports trainer for tennis taught me how to tape myself. Kenesio tape wasn't so big then, but I am sure she would be the same way with that. Like Mary said though, there is no point spending the money (it isn't cheap) and slapping it on yourself. You need to know exactly where it needs to be applied.

lbb
09-08-2010, 06:51 AM
Kinesio tape also isn't a magic pill. If you keep reinjuring yourself, no amount of tape will fix the problem.

RED
09-08-2010, 09:55 AM
Kinesio tape also isn't a magic pill. If you keep reinjuring yourself, no amount of tape will fix the problem.

She's right.
Avoid things that hurt man until you start feeling better. And once you're feeling better learn to tap out quicker and respond more dynamically. Basically, avoid re-injury.

ramenboy
09-09-2010, 02:24 PM
Kinesio tape also isn't a magic pill. If you keep reinjuring yourself, no amount of tape will fix the problem.

agree... hence, the importance of taking good ukemi :) again, that's why i stated earlier that what it DOES help with is being able to stay active while the muscle/injury recuperates.