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Sam Turnage
12-04-2008, 03:38 PM
Ant-distraction methodologies for children

Is there such a thing? What works? What doesn’t?

After finishing the book “In Search of the Warrior Spirit” ,….I think surly people have come up with effective methods of teaching kids to be less distracted, or at least not be so easily distracted.

I have three children two of witch, are of the age to attend school and martial training (10 year old daughter and 6 year old son). My daughter is daddy’s little girl , and I am very proud of her in more ways then one, and more then I could possible describe. She’s smart, a good student has taken Aikido for 3 years (8th qyu), runs crosscounty for school (consistently coming in, in the top 20 out of over 100 runners), is in the 4H club shows pigs and is now in rife sport shooting( she does so well and loves this stuff, makes us very proud), races BMX (first place in her class last week), attends Sambo classes to supplement her Aikido training, she’s planning on taking up music next month and if we had more time and money she also likes things such as cheerleading, gymnastics, and yoga. Although she is good at everything she tries to do, we have seen that she is distracted or looses focus easily and last night I got very upset about this.

Last night this was suddenly illuminated for me when we had to ground her from going to the Sambo class and any other thing that she would like to do as a form of punishment for not meeting homework goals and forgetting to bring the planner home again, and in order to catch-up on some homework, mainly required “AR” reading etc. I am not happy about it mainly because the month just started and already she is not cutting the mustard, and it was her that convinced me that she could do it, and that she really wanted to do sambo this month, and of course I am paying for it. This is the only month during the school year that this can be added to her schedule because both school and Aikido break for two weeks for Christmas. So this means that it will be hard for only 2 weeks not the whole month. So not wanting to punish “little man” or completely waste my money, I picked them up and took them to the dojo for my boy to get the class in and I figured that she would get over an hour in of reading in the lobby area. The lobby is completely detached from the gym or dojo area however, there were other kids talking and playing in the lobby so she said that she could not read. Now I realize that under these conditions she is not going to read or make her daily quota of 20 to 30 pages a day but I would expect for her to try and maybe get thru 5 pages. She did nothing! Therefore, she missed a class that I paid fore, for nothing, no gain! This just frustrated and angered me.

I later had a good long talk with her before bed about this and promised to try to help her, but I don’t know how too.

I have often gotten pissed when helping her with her homework when seeing how much work a 5th grader has to do these days, and how much time is takes away form the family and yet roll my eyes thinking that despite all this work our education system is ranked like 53rd in the world or something like that. Then I usually go off silently ranting to myself that I have to find the time and money to see that my kids get training in budo, when IMHO, it should be a fundamental part of there education. RESPECT. Is equally more important that reading, righting, and arithmetic.

But, I see now that a small part of this problem is the fact that she is getting distracted and not focused. If she doses this in class, this can mean more homework. If she does this when doing her homework it will take longer than it should.

I know this is normal, we all get distracted especially kids but, how do I help her get better at this? Life is full of distractions, especially in school.

On a lighter note, last night my boy who turned 6 on 9/11 in full resistance sambo wrestling pulled off not one but three times, some very effective ikkyos on a kid that was older and bigger then him. I thought “this stuff doesn’t really work” and “Kids can’t really learn Aikido”. :rolleyes: Yet I just saw an 11th qyu 6 year old white belt do it. LOL.:D

lbb
12-04-2008, 09:16 PM
I know this is normal, we all get distracted especially kids but, how do I help her get better at this? Life is full of distractions, especially in school.

If I may offer an opinion...it sounds to me like her life has more "distractions" than any ten-year-old should be expected to juggle and prioritize. You've got her involved in a gajillion activities, and while I'm sure she enjoys them, I'm likewise sure that it ain't all her -- clearly she's picking up on your pride in her as a super-achiever, and surely that is at least partly fueling her desire to take on yet another activity.

Many of the activities that you describe are serious pursuits. A ten-year-old child can enjoy something like that, but no ten-year-old truly understands the commitment that a serious pursuit requires. No ten-year-old is capable of understanding that they're overcommitted or of saying to a parent, "Look, Dad, enough's enough." My life at ten consisted of going to school, doing chores, doing homework, and going outside to play. Nowadays, it seems that many parents would regard that as an incredibly limited life, but I question their choices to stuff "enriching" activities down their children's throats like they were feeding a Strasbourg goose.

The problem here is not one of "distractibility", IMO, but of expecting a child to be able to focus and prioritize and manage a number of commitments that no child, and few adults, could manage. What's wrong here is the situation, not the kid. I'm sorry if that sounds like I'm criticizing your decisions; it's really not intended that way. I know you love your daughter very much and want the best for her. Sometimes, though, "the best" doesn't mean more and more enriching opportunities. Sometimes it just means letting a kid be a kid.

Janet Rosen
12-04-2008, 09:37 PM
Mary, my reaction was very much the same as your's. When I was a child none of my peers were ever expected to focus on or excel in more than one extracurricular activity at a time.

Children and teenage brains are very different from adult brains. It is NORMAL for them to act in ways we find spacey or forgetful. It is NORMAL for them to not do time management like a little adult.

I went to a good public school and in honor classes but still had time to just play with friends - take a walk, play cards or a board game - learning and building social skills AND yes, learning without trying to some time management skills and problem solving skills that don't come from structured activities.

Sam Turnage
12-04-2008, 10:53 PM
If I may offer an opinion...it sounds to me like her life has more "distractions" than any ten-year-old should be expected to juggle and prioritize. You've got her involved in a gajillion activities, and while I'm sure she enjoys them, I'm likewise sure that it ain't all her -- clearly she's picking up on your pride in her as a super-achiever, and surely that is at least partly fueling her desire to take on yet another activity.

Many of the activities that you describe are serious pursuits. A ten-year-old child can enjoy something like that, but no ten-year-old truly understands the commitment that a serious pursuit requires. No ten-year-old is capable of understanding that they're overcommitted or of saying to a parent, "Look, Dad, enough's enough." My life at ten consisted of going to school, doing chores, doing homework, and going outside to play. Nowadays, it seems that many parents would regard that as an incredibly limited life, but I question their choices to stuff "enriching" activities down their children's throats like they were feeding a Strasbourg goose.

The problem here is not one of "distractibility", IMO, but of expecting a child to be able to focus and prioritize and manage a number of commitments that no child, and few adults, could manage. What's wrong here is the situation, not the kid. I'm sorry if that sounds like I'm criticizing your decisions; it's really not intended that way. I know you love your daughter very much and want the best for her. Sometimes, though, "the best" doesn't mean more and more enriching opportunities. Sometimes it just means letting a kid be a kid.

LOL… Mary, thank you for responding and trying to help but I disagree with you and don’t think you are helping and I don’t see us agreeing on much.

Oh… where do I start? First of all, I never said “the kid is the problem” I am simply trying to help her be more focused, and less distracted, whether it be when she is just doing school work or if she is doing school, and a after school activity or two. She is not always doing all these things at once, sometimes all she does is go to school and play and the problem is still there. 90% of the time all she does after school is aikido one class or 1hr. only two days a week. BMX is not all the time, and is just Saturday night thing to do. And 4H meets only once a month per project and not all year long. I realize that you don’t know these details but I fail to see the “gajillion activities” you speak of. And I don’t understand or see the “serious pursuits” you speak of.

Frankly that sounds to me like you think we are one of those parents that make there kids do to much, push them to hard and way to young in sports, living there dreams through there kids because they weren’t good enough so if they push hard enough and young enough maybe “they” (there kid) will make it. I see this all the time in BMX, football, soccer etc. yelling at there kids. It’s very sad. But were not like that…. at all.

Personally I don’t like 4H, I grew up on a ranch and I hate tending to animals, but I have to admit, it is a great program, and I don’t like or care if they do BMX so we never push them. It’s what she likes to do right now, and I think that great.

What I asked about was how to improve focus and reduce distractions for kids.

And I am not going to go any deeper into these things because I know that we will not agree, and I do not have the time or the energy to argue on the internet about such things.

jducusin
12-04-2008, 11:26 PM
Ant-distraction methodologies for children

Is there such a thing?

Yes, there certainly is. The best strategy is to reduce distractions. :D

From what you've been saying, your daughter is not only in school, but doing:
- Aikido
- Cross-Country Running
- 4-H
- Sport Shooting
- BMX
- Sambo

and is on top of this, she is also interested in:

- music
- cheerleading
- gymnastics
- yoga

That's quite a lot! I can only imagine what must be going through her mind having so many different interests. It must be very distracting! :)

It sounds like it's time for you to sit down with your daughter and family and together decide which activities in her life should take priority. For example, if her homework and martial training are the most important, let those be her two main activities for now.

In other words, if you want your daughter to learn how to focus and concentrate, you're going to have to limit the amount of activities she has going on in her life. Focus necessarily means narrowing things down in such a way that excludes other things.

All the best to you!

J

Pauliina Lievonen
12-05-2008, 06:49 AM
I remember when I was ten, I was in a million clubs and activities, one day a week I had three different things to go to after school. Loved it. I didn't do my homework all the time, and I didn't practice for my piano lessons. I do kinda wish someone would have been a bit stricter about that, because I had to learn to work consistently at stuff much later. But I think I've grown up relatively ok anyway. :) And I'm happy I did have that opportunity to find out what kind of things I'm good at and what I love doing.

What I'd suggest is: Regular homework time every day, with some supervision - maybe not every day, but regularly sit with her and do the work together. Make sure the home work area is a quiet one, well lit, with a good table and chair. If she has something she needs to read, maybe take a book for yourself and sit and read together. That way when she starts to lose focus you can help her get back to work. Plus you get to spend quiet time together and who wouldn't love that.

kvaak
Pauliina

lbb
12-05-2008, 07:52 AM
LOL… Mary, thank you for responding and trying to help but I disagree with you and don't think you are helping and I don't see us agreeing on much.
...
And I am not going to go any deeper into these things because I know that we will not agree, and I do not have the time or the energy to argue on the internet about such things.

I guess we're not going to agree, and I'm not going to argue either. You think you don't have an overcommitted child, so there's not really any point discussing it. I do question, however, why you placed the problem before an internet forum if you weren't open to the possibility that other people would have a different take on it and you didn't "have the time and energy to argue on the internet about such things".

Marc Abrams
12-05-2008, 09:08 AM
Sam:

I speak as a grandfather, father, Aikido instructor, former children's soccer coach/ref., psychologist with a post-doc in child psych.

I have to say that I am in agreement with the other posters. I miss the days when children were simply allowed to be children. From what you described, your 10 year old daughter has good concentration and attention capacities and abilities. Developmentally, your daughter is at an age where the social scene is supplanting the home as a source of social interactions and modeling. Your daughter is wanting to try a wide array of activities in an attempt to explore the large world around her. You are fortunate that she can do a variety of activities well. I would gently encourage you to step back and look at things from some different perspectives.

From my point of view:
1) A child's number one priority is school. The greatest gift that we can give our children is the best education we can provide for them. That is not only their "job", but is an excellent venue to develop delayed gratification, increased frustration tolerance, increased concentration and attention..........
2) Children benefit from UNSTRUCTURED time with peers. We are literally killing our children's creativity and spontaneity by placing almost all of their social time in structured formats that do not force them to use their own minds to figure out how to spend the time.
3) Children are children and should be allowed to try something and move on. Too many scheduled activities can also be a poor substitute for quality time spent interacting with your children.

My pride in my children (and now grandchild as well!) is not in what they can or have achieved, but in their character. I have always been concerned about my children having the integrity, honesty and pride to be able to proverbially sign their names to what they do, regardless of what the outcome is.

Marc Abrams

Janet Rosen
12-05-2008, 10:29 AM
Marc, that is lovely. Thank you.

Joe McParland
12-05-2008, 11:13 AM
Sam, do you find that your daughter is easily distracted from doing those activities that she does enjoy? I couldn't imagine that she would stick with and excel in different things such as martial arts and marksmanship without some degree of focus and concentration...

If it's true, you can take another look at how you're viewing the problem. :)

Sam Turnage
12-05-2008, 11:59 AM
I remember when I was ten, I was in a million clubs and activities, one day a week I had three different things to go to after school. Loved it. I didn't do my homework all the time, and I didn't practice for my piano lessons. I do kinda wish someone would have been a bit stricter about that, because I had to learn to work consistently at stuff much later. But I think I've grown up relatively ok anyway. :) And I'm happy I did have that opportunity to find out what kind of things I'm good at and what I love doing.

What I'd suggest is: Regular homework time every day, with some supervision - maybe not every day, but regularly sit with her and do the work together. Make sure the home work area is a quiet one, well lit, with a good table and chair. If she has something she needs to read, maybe take a book for yourself and sit and read together. That way when she starts to lose focus you can help her get back to work. Plus you get to spend quiet time together and who wouldn't love that.

kvaak
Pauliina

good stuff thank you

Sam Turnage
12-05-2008, 12:05 PM
Yes, there certainly is. The best strategy is to reduce distractions. :D

From what you've been saying, your daughter is not only in school, but doing:
- Aikido
- Cross-Country Running
- 4-H
- Sport Shooting
- BMX
- Sambo

and is on top of this, she is also interested in:

- music
- cheerleading
- gymnastics
- yoga

That's quite a lot! I can only imagine what must be going through her mind having so many different interests. It must be very distracting! :)

It sounds like it's time for you to sit down with your daughter and family and together decide which activities in her life should take priority. For example, if her homework and martial training are the most important, let those be her two main activities for now.

In other words, if you want your daughter to learn how to focus and concentrate, you're going to have to limit the amount of activities she has going on in her life. Focus necessarily means narrowing things down in such a way that excludes other things.

All the best to you!

J

Thanks for the input. like I said She dosen't do all those things at the same time. However, maybe after telling her no to a lot of things I still need to limit even more. I will try to make sure she is not taking on to much. But I don't epect if will fix much. She will still be distracted in the class room etc.

Janet Rosen
12-05-2008, 12:22 PM
Within the classroom it would be interesting to know is she distracted or is she bored (not being intellectually challenged enough to stay with things)?
Is she distracted, or does she process information in a different mode than the teacher uses ? for instance if she is primarily a visual or kinesthetic learner (the latter may be the case if she excels in sports and m.a.), then the ongoing auditory input of much classroom activity may be very difficult for her to try to keep processing.

Sam Turnage
12-05-2008, 12:52 PM
Sam, do you find that your daughter is easily distracted from doing those activities that she does enjoy? I couldn't imagine that she would stick with and excel in different things such as martial arts and marksmanship without some degree of focus and concentration...

If it's true, you can take another look at how you're viewing the problem. :)

Yes and no, or sometimes, if that makes any sense. I see her both focused and totally unfocused in aikido. About the same as she is with school. Sometimes she’s really into it and sometimes not, seems normal to me. The shooting is only one day a month and nothing in dec. and she just started two months ago. It’s teaching her gun safety, and she thinks its fun. Yes there is a certain level of focus and concentration but it’s not like she trying to make the Olympics.

In fact now that I think about it, there is gun fire all around her and yet there she can focus and concentrate and hit the target. Is it because she doesn’t like the book that she is reading? Or is she just being a kid, “if I can’t play with my brother and the other kids kicking the bag and wrestling in sambo class than I will show him, I’m not going to do anything, and I’ll come up with a good excuse why too.” I don’t know.

I did think of this before but its not an assigned book. The AR system has lots of books to choose from. She picked the book out. If fact she had to beg her mom to let her read it because it in a little big. And we don’t really like her reading big books because there is a potential for that student to take to long to read it and by the time they are done and ready to take the test they often have forgotten some things in the beginning and can fail the test and not get any points for all the hard work.

Sam Turnage
12-05-2008, 01:41 PM
Sam:

I speak as a grandfather, father, Aikido instructor, former children's soccer coach/ref., psychologist with a post-doc in child psych.

I have to say that I am in agreement with the other posters. I miss the days when children were simply allowed to be children. From what you described, your 10 year old daughter has good concentration and attention capacities and abilities. Developmentally, your daughter is at an age where the social scene is supplanting the home as a source of social interactions and modeling. Your daughter is wanting to try a wide array of activities in an attempt to explore the large world around her. You are fortunate that she can do a variety of activities well. I would gently encourage you to step back and look at things from some different perspectives.

From my point of view:
1) A child's number one priority is school. The greatest gift that we can give our children is the best education we can provide for them. That is not only their "job", but is an excellent venue to develop delayed gratification, increased frustration tolerance, increased concentration and attention..........
2) Children benefit from UNSTRUCTURED time with peers. We are literally killing our children's creativity and spontaneity by placing almost all of their social time in structured formats that do not force them to use their own minds to figure out how to spend the time.
3) Children are children and should be allowed to try something and move on. Too many scheduled activities can also be a poor substitute for quality time spent interacting with your children.

My pride in my children (and now grandchild as well!) is not in what they can or have achieved, but in their character. I have always been concerned about my children having the integrity, honesty and pride to be able to proverbially sign their names to what they do, regardless of what the outcome is.

Marc Abrams

Marc,

Thanks you very much for your reply. I new we had people like you on this board. I agree completely with your last statement and that is exactly why she is in and is what she will get out of Aikido and 4H. I would love to talk to you in person about all this.

Point #1. We do stress this point with our children.

#2. I also agree with this and have seen it. But there are PROs and CONs We argue with our friends (that have younger kids) about this all the time. They are paranoid of sending there kids to daycare or school, and only point out the cons. We live in the country and they don’t have a lot of peers around so you have to have play date or sleep overs and we never do that on school day. And it doesn’t get done enough on the weekends with our activities and hobbies as you can see. I will make a point it do this more. Thanks. I know that the pros out weight the cons but we have a sick society and I have to mention the fact that there are little you know what, kids out there teaching your kids bad things and trying to undue all that you have and are teaching your kids. They are bad mainly because of bad parenting and teaching. They have none of the qualities that you spoke of and no responsibility. I see time and time again that most parents are trying to be there kids best friend and they are lazy. They will tell no ask , little Johnny to not play with the stick that has nails in it 10 times and then when he still has not complied just give up and walk away with there cheep beer in there hand.

#3 agreed

dps
12-08-2008, 08:05 AM
You may be helping her too much and having her do too many things you want.

David

mathewjgano
12-08-2008, 12:36 PM
2) Children benefit from UNSTRUCTURED time with peers. We are literally killing our children's creativity and spontaneity by placing almost all of their social time in structured formats that do not force them to use their own minds to figure out how to spend the time.

I just wanted to echo this a little with my wife's perspective. My wife teaches second grade in an advance placement program and it's her opinion that most of her gifted students need to experience more unstructured time. They don't know how to use their imaginations as much as other populations she's taught (where the students were frankly experiencing too much unstructured time), and they don't always do well without prompts guiding their actions.
Now, I'm not saying this 10 year old is too busy. I'm a fan of having many many hobbies (you name it and I'm probably interested in it). I like stimulus and think people should try to be more stimulatd in general, but the ability to sit in quiet with just your thoughts or to play one on one without prompts is just as valuable. Where that ability begins to lack, I think it becomes more and more important. Once again it seems to come back to balance for me.
That said, Sam, have you tried introducing meditative exercises? Yoga might not be a bad hobby for this, though I know many yoga classes in my area aren't always what I think of as meditative. Still, mind puzzles, etc. can all help a person develop their ability to focus.

mathewjgano
12-08-2008, 04:19 PM
Jimbo, that's a great list! I think you just distilled about $1000.00 worth of the education degree I've been working on. :uch: evileyes