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xuzen
11-06-2006, 10:56 PM
SHOMEN-ATE (TM) (http://www.break.com/index/taken_down_by_vegas_police.html) for the win!

Shomen-ate as it is intended. Good technique.

Boon.

Joe Jutsu
11-07-2006, 02:04 AM
And one might wonder why our esteemed law enforcement officers have such a bad rep in this country!?

On the flipside of the coin, I've seen many a frat boy, such as the young man being accosted by the police officer in this video, try to pull similar tactics, but without the same proficiency and effectivenes. So yeah, I guess this cop had really effective technique, and since his victim, I mean his uke, was offering such a violent stance this is a classic version of Shomen-ate as it should be, ie as O Sensei had envisioned it. :freaky:

ian
11-07-2006, 04:25 AM
I think the officer was justified. The reason he asks the man to take his hands out of his pockets is incase he has a concealed weapon. The police officer was pleasant and was called to the scene of a disturbance (it wasn't just a random act) and he asked many times. Unlike most of us, these officers have seen violence on a day to day basis and understand the risk of not responding properly. He didn't beat him or anything, I would definately say the force was appropriate to the situation.

In non-tomiki aikido we don't have this 'shomen-ate' but would consider this a tenchi-nage. I quite like the throat grip (less likely to slip off than under the chin, although hard to take the head back). I've considered teaching this 'version' to beginners since it is so easy to apply with little training (notice also, he tries to slip his right leg slightly behind).

L. Camejo
11-07-2006, 05:56 AM
Good Shomen Ate!

:D

Nick Simpson
11-07-2006, 06:10 AM
Nice. I agree with Ian, completely appropiate. Shame about thekids reflexes, then again, resisting is likely to get you tasered/shot...

mickeygelum
11-07-2006, 06:56 AM
Now that is pro-active law enforcement...outstanding form also, curious if he trains?

Miku-san

odudog
11-07-2006, 09:20 AM
It's interesting to me that the second cop on the scene took it to that level while the first cop did absolutely nothing. Why was it that the first cop thought that there was no need for this type of action? Notice how the kid didn't say anything in a raised voice or make any threating movements.

Nick Simpson
11-07-2006, 09:22 AM
Doesnt really matter does it? The kid didnt comply with the officers request.

Ron Tisdale
11-07-2006, 12:02 PM
a) Kid??? He's bigger and probably heavier than I am.

b) Don't want to comply? No problem...but don't cry about it when the beating commenses.

c) Nice shomen ate! Also known as shomen tsuki in yoshinkan parlance.

d) First officer was alone...may not have wanted to engage until backup arrived. Wise decision.

Best,
Ron

MM
11-07-2006, 12:33 PM
At that distance, that "kid" could have pulled a knife and cut one of the officers several times before either officer could respond. A competent knife fighter could have killed either officer at that distance. Some knives have a hook on the back of the blade such that they auto open when pulled from the pants pocket. With his hands like they were, you really couldn't tell if he had a knife in his pocket. You work off of the theory of what your opponent can possibly do, not what he probably will do. :)

Notice how the officer kept a slightly safer distance while using verbal commands, but when the officer knew he would have to use action, he moved forward and in front of the kid as he was still commanding the "kid" to take hands out of pockets.

I'd say fairly effective use of distance, timing, and shomen-ate.

Ron Tisdale
11-07-2006, 01:03 PM
And beats the HELL out of getting shot. Possibly better than getting tasered...

B,
R

MM
11-07-2006, 01:48 PM
And beats the HELL out of getting shot. Possibly better than getting tasered...

B,
R

LOL! Yeah, for sure. I got tasered for what seemed like an eternity but was really only a second or two. Not really something you'd want to be on the other end of. But, hey, least now I can say I've been tasered. :)

Ron Tisdale
11-07-2006, 01:50 PM
Mark...we REALLY need to get you a LIFE! :)

Best,
Ron (that pillow for my neck is GREAT!)

MM
11-07-2006, 01:58 PM
Mark...we REALLY need to get you a LIFE! :)

Best,
Ron (that pillow for my neck is GREAT!)

ROTFL! Yeah, you're probably right.

Glad to hear it's helping. :)

Mark

Lan Powers
11-07-2006, 10:57 PM
Nice move...we call that a agu-tsuki or rising thrust... VERY well applied. I am not sure if I have the spelling right. Anyone else use that term?
Lan

xuzen
11-07-2006, 11:14 PM
This Shomen-ate thingy makes me wonder...

Why take 20 years to learn (kokyu-nage) when Shomen-ate is available (aka the 20 hours technique) for fast effective problem solving.

Boon.

Joe Jutsu
11-07-2006, 11:38 PM
This Shomen-ate thingy makes me wonder...

Why take 20 years to learn (kokyu-nage) when Shomen-ate is available (aka the 20 hours technique) for fast effective problem solving.

Boon.
It took 20 years for O Sensei to come up with kokyunage, and definitely shouldn't take twenty years to learn to execute it. (not that I've gotten it mind you :) )

Yann Golanski
11-08-2006, 12:59 AM
This Shomen-ate thingy makes me wonder...

Why take 20 years to learn (kokyu-nage) when Shomen-ate is available (aka the 20 hours technique) for fast effective problem solving.

Boon.

Because then you are one of those Shodothugs wannabes and not a pure Aikidoka using his mystical ki!!! Sheeeeeeesh. I don't know.

Nick Simpson
11-08-2006, 02:04 AM
We call it 'Irimi-Tsuki'. Lovely technique, especially when coupled with the leading leg and hip being put behind uke.

MM
11-08-2006, 04:56 AM
This Shomen-ate thingy makes me wonder...

Why take 20 years to learn (kokyu-nage) when Shomen-ate is available (aka the 20 hours technique) for fast effective problem solving.

Boon.

Speaking of 20 year techniques ... I first heard that irimi nage was a 20 year technique, then I heard that kokyu nage was a 20 year technique.

Anyone know where this "20 year technique" (no matter what it is) urban legend came from?

Yann Golanski
11-08-2006, 05:24 AM
Speaking of 20 year techniques ... I first heard that irimi nage was a 20 year technique, then I heard that kokyu nage was a 20 year technique.

Anyone know where this "20 year technique" (no matter what it is) urban legend came from?

Yeah, it's a plot by older sensei to put thier 2/3 dan students in their place: Hum, you only trained for 15 years. "This is a 20 year technique so you still have lots to learn my little padawan. Mwahahahaah!!!! </evil>"

Anyone can learn any technique in 15 minutes but to know it well enough to be able to use it in any situation takes a long time -- hence the "20" years mojo.

jxa127
11-08-2006, 06:41 AM
What is "FTW"???

John A Butz
11-08-2006, 07:25 AM
For the Win

Hows the family Drew? Good to see you around, you need to come up and train sometime!

jxa127
11-08-2006, 02:08 PM
Hi John,

My son, John, will be 1 year old in a week and a half! He's doing very well and my wife and I are...well... adapting. :-D

I'm actually planning on coming over to train pretty soon.

Regards,

-Drew

Steven
11-08-2006, 04:08 PM
LOL! Yeah, for sure. I got tasered for what seemed like an eternity but was really only a second or two. Not really something you'd want to be on the other end of. But, hey, least now I can say I've been tasered. :)


I know this is off topic, but is it just me or is there anyone else even remotely wondering why Mark got tasered? :hypno:

PeterR
11-08-2006, 05:57 PM
Yes - but as a well bred Shodothug I would never ask.

Nick Simpson
11-09-2006, 03:51 AM
I know this is off topic, but is it just me or is there anyone else even remotely wondering why Mark got tasered?

He just wouldnt leave the cakes alone...

MM
11-09-2006, 05:19 AM
I know this is off topic, but is it just me or is there anyone else even remotely wondering why Mark got tasered? :hypno:

Hello Steven,
The answer is rather simple. I was simply out of my mind at the time. LOL.

Seriously (and long story short), there was a demo going on for a taser company. Part of that demo was getting to feel the actual effects of the taser. There were quite a few of us idiots that tried it.

Mark

MM
11-09-2006, 07:34 AM
Yes - but as a well bred Shodothug I would never ask.

ah, but as a Shodothug, would you beat it out of me? Using aiki, of course. ;)

Mark

PeterR
11-09-2006, 06:10 PM
ah, but as a Shodothug, would you beat it out of me? Using aiki, of course. ;)

Mark
Absolutely not - we would merely use our patented glower while delicately holding our cup of tea. You would confess in no time.

So how many of those volunteers spent the rest of the day wishing they hadn't been so silly.

MM
11-09-2006, 06:41 PM
Absolutely not - we would merely use our patented glower while delicately holding our cup of tea. You would confess in no time.

So how many of those volunteers spent the rest of the day wishing they hadn't been so silly.

LOL! I like the tea part. Classy.

Actually, there were a few females that tried it. And one guy that lasted about five seconds. Impressive.