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BKimpel
09-25-2006, 09:42 PM
Check out this old footage that someone converted and uploaded of O-Sensei in Iwama (the title says Wakayama, 1952 when O-sensei was 69 years old).

Old O-Sensei Footage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwQ3HZgz32Q)

Anyone know who some of those yudansha are besides Saito (I recognize him). They are all scanned by the camera at the beginning?

Bronson
09-25-2006, 11:15 PM
I believe the first and second were his son Kisshomaru, and Koichi Tohei, respectively

Bronson

BKimpel
09-25-2006, 11:35 PM
Ya, of course Kisshomaru (I should have mentioned him as well).
Koichi Tohei eh? I think you are right Bronson.
I think the third guy with the goofy looking grin is Rinjiro Shirata (he was a big guy when he was young)?

So thus far, from right to left:
Kisshomaru Ueshiba
Koichi Tohei
Rinjiro Shirata?
Morihiro Saito
Tallhair guy?
Squinting guy?
Moustache guy?

This little movie gem is a who's who in Aikido in 1952!

Checkout O-Sensei's ninja jo moves. He is fast for an old guy, and he has a little bit of a hop now and then - fantastic for a guy his age.

Mike Hamer
09-26-2006, 12:25 AM
Hahahaha, this is the video that on my myspace

acot
09-26-2006, 01:22 AM
Simply beautiful...


Ryan

Aristeia
09-26-2006, 01:26 AM
that may be the most impressive video of Ueshiba I've seen. Very nice.

Chris Li
09-26-2006, 02:06 AM
Ya, of course Kisshomaru (I should have mentioned him as well).
Koichi Tohei eh? I think you are right Bronson.
I think the third guy with the goofy looking grin is Rinjiro Shirata (he was a big guy when he was young)?

So thus far, from right to left:
Kisshomaru Ueshiba
Koichi Tohei
Rinjiro Shirata?
Morihiro Saito
Tallhair guy?
Squinting guy?
Moustache guy?

This little movie gem is a who's who in Aikido in 1952!


Kisshomaru, Tohei, and Saito are certainly correct. The big guy doesn't look much like Shirata to me, but I could well be mistaken. The squinting guy looks a little bit like Noiraki Inoue, and the guy on the end with the mustache looks like Hiroshi Tada to me...

Anyway, if I remember correctly this is a segment from a film that was professionally made in order for Tohei to take it with him to Hawaii when he went shortly after in 1953 (but I may be wrong about that as well...).

Best,

Chris

CitoMaramba
09-26-2006, 10:22 AM
The clip is from the Aiki News Video, "Takemusu Aiki". Perhaps if someone were to ask Mr. Pranin...

BKimpel
09-26-2006, 10:46 AM
Cito, I posted a link on AikidoJournal now - thanks.

Chris, I think your right about Hiroshi Tada (see attachment 1).
It is a picture of him in Lido, Venetia, Italy, 1968 only 16 years later (he looks pretty much the same).

As for Rinjiro Shirata...Check out this picture of him (attachment 2).
Notice his eyebrows and the shape of his nose – I think it is him (but I could be mistaken too).

As for Noriaki Inoue? Attachment 3 is Yoichiro “Noriaki” Inoue, Tanabe, c. 1946, just 7 years earlier so I think you may be right.
But I thought they had already split up and weren't talking.
Unless this one of those times where they tolerated each other for the sake of the news exposure?

Chris Li
09-26-2006, 01:02 PM
As for Noriaki Inoue? Attachment 3 is Yoichiro "Noriaki" Inoue, Tanabe, c. 1946, just 7 years earlier so I think you may be right.
But I thought they had already split up and weren't talking.
Unless this one of those times where they tolerated each other for the sake of the news exposure?

The scowl definitely looks like Inoue - they were on the outs by that time, but there was some contact, so it's not impossible.

Best,

Chris

ChrisMoses
09-26-2006, 01:41 PM
So I'll just throw this out there: what strikes me most about this video is how similar he looked to when he was younger. There's a lot of talk about how much his waza changed in the post war period, and I'm sure it did, but I don't think *his* waza changed as much as say the post-war uchideshi who went on to lead the worldwide expansion of Aikido. Indeed, there are points in this video that are nearly identical to the Noma dojo photos. Good stuff.

Alfonso
09-26-2006, 02:19 PM
I agree, the "budo video" of the Asahi News demonstration also shows very similar form and movement.

Neal Earhart
09-26-2006, 03:00 PM
He is fast for an old guy, and he has a little bit of a hop now and then - fantastic for a guy his age.
An old guy ? A guy his age ? :freaky:

Tamura Shihan age 73
Yamada Shihan age 68
Chiba Shihan age 66
Sugano Shihan age 67

I will attest to the fact that the above Shihans move really fast for "old guys"....faster than most of us "younger guys" ;) :D :D

BKimpel
09-26-2006, 04:55 PM
So Mr.Pranin piped in and corrected us.

So the list is actually:
Kisshomaru Ueshiba
Koichi Tohei
Rinjiro Shirata
Morihiro Saito
Tadashii Abe (with the tall hair)
Kiyoshi Sakuma (a teacher out of Osaka)
Nariaki Hirano (a relatively unknown teacher in Tanabe, a contemporary of Michio Hikitsuchi)

And yes Neal, 69 (70) is old. If you are 70, and don't know it...you're old. Just to let you know your old.
Ha ha, just bugging. Needless to say O-sensei moves darn good for 69 in that film, and a lot more than he did in a lot of other footage (IMO).

Peter Goldsbury
09-27-2006, 12:12 AM
So Mr.Pranin piped in and corrected us.

So the list is actually:
Kisshomaru Ueshiba
Koichi Tohei
Rinjiro Shirata
Morihiro Saito
Tadashii Abe (with the tall hair)
Kiyoshi Sakuma (a teacher out of Osaka)
Nariaki Hirano (a relatively unknown teacher in Tanabe, a contemporary of Michio Hikitsuchi)

And yes Neal, 69 (70) is old. If you are 70, and don't know it...you're old. Just to let you know your old.
Ha ha, just bugging. Needless to say O-sensei moves darn good for 69 in that film, and a lot more than he did in a lot of other footage (IMO).

And what was Rinjiro Shirata doing in Iwama in 1952, when he had supposedly stopped aikido altogether? I think the person between Tohei and Saito is a youthful Shoji Nishio.

CitoMaramba
09-27-2006, 03:09 AM
I wonder why the uploader of the video said it is footage of O-Sensei in Iwama, when the subtitle on the clip itself says "Wakayama, 1952".

BKimpel
09-27-2006, 07:52 PM
Shoji Nishio just started Aikido in 1951, do you think he was even Yudansha by then?
Maybe. I don't think it really looks like Shoji - but I could be wrong.

Stan Pranin rattled off the list (assumingly from some documentation of the event), but maybe he didn't notice Rinjiro on my list or something.

Ya I don't know why it says Iwama on the title, wakayama in the film!?!

David Orange
09-27-2006, 10:11 PM
An old guy ? A guy his age ? :freaky:

Tamura Shihan age 73
Yamada Shihan age 68
Chiba Shihan age 66
Sugano Shihan age 67

I will attest to the fact that the above Shihans move really fast for "old guys"....faster than most of us "younger guys" ;) :D :D

However, those guys are those ages "now," and they have benefitted greatly from the improved economy, better diet and easier lifestyles than O-Sensei experienced. He had a much tougher life than any of the modern "old timers".

In fact, it seems that that old, tougher life was better for him than the modern life is for them or any of us. But then, he lived a very pure and frugal life, very close to nature.

My observation.

David

Basia Halliop
09-28-2006, 07:07 AM
In fact, it seems that that old, tougher life was better for him than the modern life is for them or any of us. But then, he lived a very pure and frugal life, very close to nature.
David

I sometimes have the converse thought (not about O Sensei, just in general). A sort of natural selection. If you live a very harsh life, maybe if you actually survive to 69 there's a somewhat greater chance that you're tough/healthy or have some particularly long-life genes. I would think a much higher percentage of his contemporaries didn't make it that far than would be the case today.

markwalsh
09-28-2006, 07:58 AM
Nice ukes if you can get them!

markwalsh
09-28-2006, 08:03 AM
This has become my second favourite O Sensei film...
My first is where he take ukemi for a 10 year old boy with a big grin -very cool -anyone knoiw if this is online?

Michael Douglas
09-28-2006, 06:38 PM
So this is where they get the idea to throw themselves backward to the ground ... bizarre.
Demos are rubbish, they should be banned.